Date: 2009-11-02 06:16 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thatnickguy.insanejournal.com
Good writing: Not necissarily bringing back Alberto, but having him look much like his father.

Bad writing: Batman throwing down a smoke bomb and having one of the gangsters explain it. This isn't the Silver Age anymore, folks. Not everything needs to be explains with text.

Date: 2009-11-02 07:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] essaybee.insanejournal.com
I think he had to explain that Batman dropped the gas balls. Seeing as how they're all dressed as cowboys, he had to be sure the others knew it wasn't just the campfire beans kicking in.

Date: 2009-11-02 06:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
Yeeeeeah. See, this is what happens when you let Tony Daniel near the writing. Guy's a great artist, no doubt -- he even did an excellent scene between Dick and Selina.

But the rest of the story? Jumbled and very rough. And I was very surprised to see this addition.
As well, when was the last time we actually saw Selina steal jewels? Just seems to be very random.

Daniel should really stick with the art. PLEASE, DC?!

Date: 2009-11-02 07:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] icon_uk.insanejournal.com
Why? Selina IS a jewel thief, the fact she doesn't do it consistently, doesn't mean she is any less a jewel thief, or not be apt to do it again if the mood, or circumstances, made it desirable.

Date: 2009-11-02 10:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
She is, but I'm just being very nit-picky and grumpy regarding Daniel's stuff. :-P

Date: 2009-11-02 07:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yaseen101.insanejournal.com
As long as the man doesn't flaunce his ego I tend to give him a lot of pass considering he is still relatively new to the field. But why on earth would DC put an inexperienced man who is still new to the writing gig on one of their highest selling books? Is it because he can easily be controlled by editorial? Which wouldn't surprise me since Didio called Coutdown "52 done right!" and in 52 Didio had very little editorial control over. Or is it because the man has good ideas and some exceptional skills? Well his writing and art has clearly improved since BftC but I wouldn't call him exceptional.

Date: 2009-11-02 07:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] icon_uk.insanejournal.com
But why on earth would DC put an inexperienced man who is still new to the writing gig on one of their highest selling books?

Perhaps because he has a good track record of being on time with his work, had expressed an interest in writing, is intimately familiar with the Batclan. Plus perhaps a deliberate effort to have a NEW writer's take on Batman since it IS a new Batman.

A risky strategy, but I'll see how it goes.

Date: 2009-11-02 07:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yaseen101.insanejournal.com
What happened to working your way up the ladder?

Yes, but the kind of people you mention usually gets mini-series or 2-3 issue arcs not event books like BftC.
Anyway, I choose to believe in more ridiculous theories even if it is for the laughs.

Date: 2009-11-02 08:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] triss-neya.livejournal.com (from insanejournal.com)
A new writer's take on a new Batamn...hmmm. That doesn't really work since it isn't really an entirely new character. Not only is there a lot of backstory but a stint as Batman in the past as well. The writer doesn't get to reinvent how this Batman will act. He has to base it on the character's backstory.
(I'm still very ticked off at him for what he did to Jason)

Date: 2009-11-02 08:46 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] triss-neya.livejournal.com (from insanejournal.com)
*headdesk* I meant Batman ...not Batamn *is embarrassed*

Date: 2009-11-02 08:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] arilou_skiff.insanejournal.com
Because it *is* their highest selling book?

Basically, Batman will sell if written by a pair of chimps. Better put the good writers to work on more obscure titles where people might be tempted to go there for the writer's sake.

Date: 2009-11-02 08:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] yaseen101.insanejournal.com
Yeah, but then the sales will just stay that way but if they get a really good writer, like Ed Brubaker, Greg Rucka or Peter Tomasi, then the sales will be even higher. Why do you think the GL book's sales have stayed consistently high since Rebirth?

Date: 2009-11-02 10:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
Oh, it's certainly improved since BftC and is nowhere near as cliche.

But, agreed, why would DC put someone inexperienced at writing on one of their biggest books?
Sometimes I just think it's b/c DC hates us. Yep. That's it.

Date: 2009-11-02 10:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] darkknightjrk.insanejournal.com
"Sometimes I just think it's b/c DC hates us. Yep. That's it."

And they express their hate by bringing in a newer writer who's a bit mediocre but steadily improving? No, if they really hate us they would have given the writing gig to Chuck Austin and had art by Rob Liefeld.

Date: 2009-11-02 10:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] runespoor7.insanejournal.com
So far all the proof we have that Daniel is "steadily improving" is that it's not horrible, whereas BftC 2 and 3 were each worse than the last.

Date: 2009-11-02 10:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
I don't think you can judge "steadily improving" by one issue.

Date: 2009-11-02 07:21 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] killermoth1.insanejournal.com
I don't like this. I didn't like Dark Victory a heap but it was still enjoyable, but one of my favourite parts of it was that it showed a high ranking gang member (Mario) wanting to get out of that life so much that in the end he simply burnt up the Falcone residence and left.

So naturally, since "inspiring" superhero comics rely entirely on no one being able to reform ever, he's back now. And this is like what? 15 years later?

Date: 2009-11-02 08:07 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jaybee3.insanejournal.com
Dark Victory is what? Year 3? That should be at least 12-13 years ago then according to Morrison's "Bruce has been Batman 15 years" scale. Also if DV (and Long Halloween) is strict canon now then "Bruce" and "Selina" (as opposed to Batman and Catwoman) have been intimate off-and-on for a likewise 12-14 years (as opposed to their revised Post-Crisis meeting - in civilian guise - during the Knightfall/NML era).

As for Daniel, I think he got a lot of brownie points because of Battle for the Cowl from Didio. Remember Geoff Johns got thrust into DC's big-wigs eyes (away from the Star and S.T.R.I.P.E series he created) because he was almost the only writer they could find who was willing to do "Day of Judgement" according to Geoff himself (this is the story in which Hal becomes Spectre). Geoff was basically handed the plotline (just as Daniel was with BfTC) and told to work from there. Years later, Johns had enough power bring Hal back as GL, ret-con Emerald Twilight and make Green Lantern one of DC's highest-selling books with Hal as the lead (something readers were told couldn't be done during the Emerald Twilight period).

DC has a bunch of go-to writers who are willing to do basically dialogue for whatever Editorial piece Didio has already mapped out (think Will Pfeiffer with Amazons Attack, Adam Beechan with the Batgirl fiasco and Countdown, Gray and Palmiotti also with Countdown, Sean McKeever with the slutty Ms. Martian and Wonder Twins mauled Teen Titans era and, again, also with Countdown). And then in return these guys will usually get rewarded with some leeway of their own (for instance, Gray and Palmiotti's PowerGirl book might as well exist in its own universe).

Date: 2009-11-02 08:11 pm (UTC)
ext_396464: (Default)
From: [identity profile] xdoop.insanejournal.com
he was almost the only writer they could find who was willing to do "Day of Judgement" according to Geoff himself

Where did he say this?

Date: 2009-11-02 08:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jaybee3.insanejournal.com
I believe in one interview (its on the net somewhere) when asked how he got started. He mentioned Star and S.T.R.I.P.E. and then said they asked him to do "Day of Judgement" because no one else was wanted to do it. He could be joking of course, but maybe not - since had very little under his belt under the time and suddenly was given the mini-series in which Hal gets made the new Spectre and starring most of the big players of the DCU.

Date: 2009-11-03 12:34 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] zordboy.insanejournal.com
Given the quality of "Day of Judgement", that isn't too surprising.

Date: 2009-11-02 08:06 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thehefner.insanejournal.com
I was really hoping that LONG HALLOWEEN and DARK VICTORY alike would only be fuzzily in canon, at best. Ah well. Hopefully future writers will continue to ignore those storylines, plus anything else Tony Daniel does this time. I mean, I don't even *like* Jason, and BATTLE FOR THE COWL ticked me off.

Date: 2009-11-02 10:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
You don't like Jason?

Sniff, sniff. We need to talk, Hef. ;-)

Date: 2009-11-02 10:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thehefner.insanejournal.com
Hey, I don't hate Jason either! I just dislike Winnick's writing OF Jason!

Date: 2009-11-02 10:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] benicio127.insanejournal.com
HAH! Actually it was Winick's writing of him that made me like him.

Granted, Winick can be hit or miss, but I thought his Jason was great. I like the idea as well that while he took the Red Hood mask and re-invented it, he was against the idea of playing "dress up" -- another thumbing of the nose to his father figure.

Date: 2009-11-03 05:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lieut_kettch.insanejournal.com
Does anyone still use Tommy guns anymore?

Date: 2009-11-03 05:51 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] rorge.insanejournal.com
Dark Victory has always been canon, just like Long Halloween is.

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