box_in_the_box: (Default)
Shooting You with My Smile ([personal profile] box_in_the_box) wrote in [community profile] scans_daily2009-11-23 02:19 am

Comics wank colliding with political wank: Like matter and anti-matter ...

I look forward to seeing the perfect storm of wank calm and rational debate that will ensue in the comments, between competing factions of both superhero comics fans and public policy ideologues.

Superman supports health care and welfare!

From back in the day when Superman used his moral force to say we should do this because it's the right thing to do for our neighbors, never mind if it cost us some tax dollars.

Of course, today he'd be attacked for his position because, after all, he's an illegal immigrant.

And like so many other illegals, we just want him to clean up our messes and do the jobs we can't do for ourselves for non-existent pay, but that doesn't mean we have to acknowledge when he might have a point.

But I could be mistaken. Is there someone out there who can explain why Superman is wrong?

(Hat tip to Kevin H and Wesley Osam.)
This was originally posted online near the end of August, but I don't recall seeing it on this comm, so I thought I'd share it with you all.
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 04:51 pm (UTC)(link)
Whatever legal papers establish him as Clark Kent also contain his citizenship status. The Daily Planet probably did a background check, as did his schools.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 06:42 pm (UTC)(link)
Except Clark Kent is technically like Tarzan, Lord of the Apes: Tarzan was still Lord Greystoke and aware of it or not, Superman was still not biologically human. It would be a surprise if he even necessarily had the same A-G-T-C basis as Earth life.
darkblade: (Default)

[personal profile] darkblade 2009-11-23 06:47 pm (UTC)(link)
Well the existance of Superboy suggests that he at least has to be somewhat biologically similar to human.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 07:03 pm (UTC)(link)
And humans are 97% identical to gorillas. Somewhat biologically similar takes in everything from the gibbon to the gorilla, so that's not entirely saying that Superman could breed with humans in any case.
darkblade: (Default)

[personal profile] darkblade 2009-11-23 07:11 pm (UTC)(link)
Similar enough that somehting that is half Lex and half Superman to be biologically viable. That is more so than humans and gorillas.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 07:13 pm (UTC)(link)
Actually, the difference between humans and chimpanzees is less than rats and mice. Presumably a human-chimp hybrid could be made providing the chimp wasn't interested in tearing the human apart if he sooner or later got pissed. Still not enough.
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 06:56 pm (UTC)(link)
Your assumption that Clark is not biologically human comes from where exactly? Because everything I've read (and, granted, I curtailed a LOT post-Crisis), made the point that the Kryptonians are biologically homo sapiens, except for their ability to process certain radiations. Again, a more scientifically primitive time, but that's how it was presented. Besides, almost all of the mythos assumes that Clark and Lois are capable of mating and reproducing.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 07:05 pm (UTC)(link)
Not all.

The problem is that the kind of physiology that permits radiation to be the equivalent of Godzilla-scale steroids is not the kind of physiology that would be internally anything close to human. And in any case, if Krypton was another world where something like humans evolved, whatever happened to black Kryptonians?
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 07:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Krypton was like Northern Minnesota?I kid. We see them on New Krypton.
But, as I maintained, the BASIS of the Superman myth is reliant in part on an era that was not as scientifically advanced. Initially, Kryptonians didn't even store radiation. Their powers turned on or off like a light switch under red or yellow sun radiation.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 07:32 pm (UTC)(link)
You do have a point that the initial basis was incoherent, but passing it off as bizarre alien biology would solve one bit of fridge logic and open a couple more logic-fridges.
icon_uk: (Default)

[personal profile] icon_uk 2009-11-23 07:28 pm (UTC)(link)
Pre-Crisis Superman was anything but human, his molecular structure was of incredible density and his actual weight was enormous, countered by his ability to defy gravity.

Post-Crisis Superman is a lot closer to human in terms of physiology, but even then he has a triple helix DNA which made cloning him impossible, resulting in a Bizzaro, and to produce Superboy, requiring advanced cloning and genetic modificationwith human DNA.
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 07:46 pm (UTC)(link)
Still, the able-to-mate-with-humans thing, PLUS Martha Kent, a nice enough woman, but relatively normal, was able to raise him.
halialkers: (Default)

[personal profile] halialkers 2009-11-23 07:48 pm (UTC)(link)
People can raise damn near anything if they try hard enough, the surprise is that anything human-made is edible to Clark.
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 07:50 pm (UTC)(link)
Which is probably the excuse Clark uses with Lois..,,
icon_uk: (Default)

[personal profile] icon_uk 2009-11-23 07:53 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't think "only viable with extraordinary interventions and extensive genetic resequencing by the worlds foremost geniuses in the field" counts as "able to mate with humans", as far as we know, Kryptonians can't mate with humans naturally.
kenn_el: Northstar_Hmm (Default)

[personal profile] kenn_el 2009-11-23 07:58 pm (UTC)(link)
Like I said earlier, most of the mythos allows for their potential progeny. And, again, advances in science and attempts at scientific 'accuracy' have changed some of the basics over time.
squirrama: (Silver Age Silliness)

[personal profile] squirrama 2009-11-24 09:38 pm (UTC)(link)
I seem to remember that right before the introduction of Chris, Clark had STAR labs run some tests and he can NOT naturally mate with humans.