iskander: (Default)
[personal profile] iskander posting in [community profile] scans_daily


So, here is where it all went SO wrong. Extent merges the golden age hawks with Katar Hol/Hawkman of Thanagar. Zero hour...

Tags

Carter Hall/Hawkman,Katar Hol/Hawkman,Sheara Hall/Hawkgirl,Char:Extant,Group:JSA,Event:Zero Hour








DC decided that the JSA had just gotten too old and no amount of magic pixie dust could explain how characters in their 60's and 70's could still be in action.







This is it three characters became one 2 guys and woman ( which did make you wonder what was under the Hawk-god"'s loin cloth.

I will admit tho' hawkman didn't get it worst in Zero hour. That would be Guy Gardner and that whole "Warrior" mess...

Date: 2010-01-13 03:47 pm (UTC)
thokstar: Spot (Default)
From: [personal profile] thokstar
I will admit tho' hawkman didn't get it worst in Zero hour. That would be Guy Gardner and that whole "Warrior" mess...

A bad costume and an ongoing>a convoluted history that causes you from not being published.

(Plus Hal and Hawk got it worse than either of them.)

It always astonishes me how mediocre Zero Hour is. It's either random energy blasts with technocolor or white backgrounds, or Superman and a bunch of other superheroes standing around hoping Waverider will tell them what to do.

Date: 2010-01-13 04:04 pm (UTC)
jlroberson: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jlroberson
And as many excuses to avoid backgrounds as one can think of.

Date: 2010-01-13 04:02 pm (UTC)
jaybee3: Nguyen Lil Cass (Default)
From: [personal profile] jaybee3
Zero Hour was a mess in so many ways and their treatment of the Golden Age JSA in particular (this is the last time we see Shiera, for example, EVER) was deplorable. I know Jurgens was basically a paid hit man in a situation I think even the Powers that Be at DC regret now but it could have been much better carried out. Compare this to the way Robinson and Goyer had Wes Dodds in JSA go out or the way Robinson had Ted Knight go out in Starman as real heroes. But merging Hawk avatars? WTF?

Date: 2010-01-13 05:33 pm (UTC)
tacobob: Mordecai Not Very Impressed (Default)
From: [personal profile] tacobob
I always thought it was a train-wreck, but alof of good came from it. Guess DC realized how important the GA characters were to readers, so we got Starman and then we got the JSA. :3

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] thokstar - Date: 2010-01-13 07:34 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] tacobob - Date: 2010-01-13 09:27 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] leorising - Date: 2010-01-13 10:26 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 06:09 pm (UTC)
box_in_the_box: (Default)
From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box
Actually, I get the feeling that Jurgens was doing it for a little more than just a paycheck, because back when Geoff Johns was still primarily known as "that guy who co-writes JSA," Jurgens was asked something about the longevity of his own stories' impact, and he said, "For more on that, you might as well read JSA, since that's where DC chooses to undo every other story I've written."

He sounded a mite peevish.

Date: 2010-01-13 06:16 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com
It wasn't just Jurgens, though. Slightly before Zero Hour there had been a Justice Society ongoing, set in the modern day after the JSA returned from limbo. It was written by Len Straziewski and drawn by the late, great Mike Parobeck and was really entertaining. It also introduced Jesse Quick.

However, the DC powers that were at the time (in the form of some unspecified editors) felt that DC was suffering by showing "old people in costumes", and Justice Society was pulled after only ten or so issues, and then Jurgens was instructed to get rid of the JSA in Zero Hour to pave the way for some "extreme new heroes" to pick up their legacies, like the merger Hawkman (whose title I read and it was really REALLY bad) and "Fate" (the guy who got killed off in the first issue of JSA).

Basically it was the exact opposite situation of today. The golden age and silver age were seen as hokey and undesireable, things to be shuffled under the carpet and forgotten, the characters basically cannon fodder for big events.

At least Zero Hour gave us Starman...

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] jaybee3 - Date: 2010-01-13 06:40 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] thehefner - Date: 2010-01-13 07:38 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:25 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 01:11 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 01:43 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 03:16 am (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 06:21 pm (UTC)
box_in_the_box: (Default)
From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box
Also? It's amazing to look at DC from 15 years ago and realize how much of a go-to guy Dan Jurgens was for them, as both a writer and an artist (Zero Hour, the Superman titles, DC Versus Marvel), even though everything about his style is uniformly mediocre. It got to the point where they hired George Perez to do finishes on his breakdowns in titles like Teen Titans.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:26 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box - Date: 2010-01-13 10:35 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:49 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box - Date: 2010-01-13 10:55 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:58 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 06:51 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Whereas I'd always found the JSA being young and ongoing heroes 60 years after their time to be a rather irritating clutching at straws, I accept that comics have a sliding timescale, but when your characters' main schtick is that they were active in World War II, there comes a time to just let them retire and die off.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:29 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box - Date: 2010-01-13 10:59 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] icon_uk - Date: 2010-01-13 11:08 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] jaybee3 - Date: 2010-01-14 12:09 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] okkult3000 - Date: 2010-01-13 11:16 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 07:42 pm (UTC)
ext_399474: (Default)
From: [identity profile] kainnived.livejournal.com
Wait I thought Shiera showed up and was uncerimoniously killed in Rann/Thannagar war.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] kamino_neko - Date: 2010-01-13 08:00 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] pyrotwilight - Date: 2010-01-13 08:03 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-13 10:54 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] neuhallidae - Date: 2010-01-13 10:14 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] kamino_neko - Date: 2010-01-13 10:51 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 08:31 pm (UTC)
thatnickguy: Oreo-lovin' Martian (Default)
From: [personal profile] thatnickguy
Huh. I never noticed that irony before, actually.

Without Zero Hour, which basically trampled over the JSA, we wouldn't have had Robinson's Starman and as a result, the JSA title.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] hurricane-jam.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 01:46 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] jaybee3 - Date: 2010-01-14 02:37 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] jaybee3 - Date: 2010-01-14 02:50 am (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 04:04 pm (UTC)
jlroberson: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jlroberson
Ah, Zero Hour.

Dan Jurgens: "Ooh, I shouldn't have eaten Mexican. I feel a mighty big shit coming on."

DC Comics: "Here! Use our entire line of comics! And wipe with Hawkman."

Date: 2010-01-13 05:31 pm (UTC)
tacobob: Mordecai Not Very Impressed (Default)
From: [personal profile] tacobob
And don't forget they had one cover that was just WHITE. >:|

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] icon_uk - Date: 2010-01-13 06:51 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 10:32 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] zordboy - Date: 2010-01-14 01:53 am (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 05:31 pm (UTC)
tacobob: Mordecai Not Very Impressed (Default)
From: [personal profile] tacobob
That was two guys, one gal and an anthropomorphic hawk god. You would have thought the new Hawkman would have been really powerful.

Date: 2010-01-14 01:13 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com
...

Futamonster Hawkman.

OF COURSE!

Date: 2010-01-13 06:10 pm (UTC)
box_in_the_box: (Default)
From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box
I love the fact that Mark Waid basically set about ignoring Zero Hour in the next issue of The Flash IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING.

Date: 2010-01-13 08:32 pm (UTC)
thatnickguy: Oreo-lovin' Martian (Default)
From: [personal profile] thatnickguy
He did? How? Wally was just stuck in time or something and the first issue, he came back.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box - Date: 2010-01-13 08:34 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] thatnickguy - Date: 2010-01-13 08:36 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] zordboy - Date: 2010-01-14 01:54 am (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 06:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com
You know what's really sad? The first non-translated DC comic I ever bought was this issue of Zero Hour. On sale, no less. I forget why, I think I read something about it in a comics fanzine.

Back in those days, Dan Jurgens was -huge-. He had the "Death of Superman" storyline under his belt and a long well-selling run on the Supes titles, so DC was basically showering him with titles to write.

Still, the bad decisions and mediocre execution of Zero Hour left me cold. In my mind, none of the COIE remakes have held a candle to the original, quality-wise, but Zero Hour was even worse than Infinite Crisis and Final Crisis.

The best part of it in retrospect is reading about the huge deal made about Power Girl's baby and knowing it vanished into limbo almost -immediately- after.

Date: 2010-01-14 12:33 pm (UTC)
jlroberson: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jlroberson
I think two things really irritated me. One was that they bring back Babs as Batgirl--from a different earth--only to shoot her through the middle again, dead this time. It was somewhat typical of the whole thing--needless brutalization of characters and not much else.

A second is...well, I guess I just really, really hate Waverider...

Date: 2010-01-13 06:15 pm (UTC)
box_in_the_box: (Default)
From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box
And even before I new what "continuity" was, I remember reading this and thinking, "Holy shit, they just rendered Hawkman radioactive."

What's his history? What's his identity? How does he relate to the other characters in the DCU? WHO THE FUCK KNOWS???

Date: 2010-01-13 06:53 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
The problem being that by the time we got to Zero Hour, we already had no sodding clue. I can't blame Zero Hour for trying to fix it, even if it didn't work.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] box_in_the_box - Date: 2010-01-13 06:55 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-13 07:41 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] okkult3000 - Date: 2010-01-13 11:19 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-13 11:21 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-13 07:22 pm (UTC)
pyrotwilight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] pyrotwilight
Ah Zero Hour you destroyed the Team Titans, who I liked and intro'd Triumph who I liked but was later ruined. Sigh.

Date: 2010-01-13 08:34 pm (UTC)
thatnickguy: Oreo-lovin' Martian (Default)
From: [personal profile] thatnickguy
I...actually like Zero Hour.

Now, before anyone jumps on me faster than Mario on a Goomba, please keep something in mind: I started collecting comics due to the Death of Superman. And Zero Hour, as a result, was my first major crossover. I thought it was huge and awesome at the time, seeing this huge threat and everyone getting together to stop it.

It even got me to try new titles, since I was buying up #0 issues left and right. I'm probably in the minority, for example, that liked the brief Manhunter series that spun out of ZH. And of course, Starman. =D

Date: 2010-01-13 10:40 pm (UTC)
lamashtar: Shun the nonbelievers! Shun-na! (Default)
From: [personal profile] lamashtar
Oh, I like bits and pieces. Of course, I found COIE to be disjointed and confused and drawn out.

Date: 2010-01-13 09:28 pm (UTC)
christianconnor: (Default)
From: [personal profile] christianconnor
Back in the day, I liked Zero Hour too. It was my first major crossover, and I'd heard of (but never read) COIE, I was fascinated by a "sequel".

Also, I think it was a nice way of getting rid of the awkward Hawk continuity that COIE and Hawkworld left behind. If only the follow-up had, you know, worked.

The bit with Jay and Alan passing on the torch was good, but (thinking back) it would have been better for the JSA to go out with a victory. They pointlessly got beaten by a new villain...

...Only for the villain to immediately fade in power and threat as soon as Hal turned up. Even as a kid I wondered why everyone was just ignoring him. And Waverider's line when Extant legs it near the end:

"Leave him! That one will ultimately defeat himself."

What? Such a cavalier attitude about the guy who killed half the JSA!

Date: 2010-01-13 10:47 pm (UTC)
lamashtar: The Great Hal Jordan (awesome)
From: [personal profile] lamashtar
Extant somehow came across as a punk who got lucky. I never understood why such a maniac would toady to Parallax, no matter HOW powerful he was, but he did...I guess because the relationship became more of a Leader Bad Guy and his Stalking Horse Second. Classic villain trope but didn't seem to suit the two of them at all. But Parallax did have such a presence as a villain, you just knew he was the one to watch out for...I miss him!

And it's always annoyed me that we get no followup from Hal and Hawk...

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] icon_uk - Date: 2010-01-13 11:15 pm (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] lamashtar - Date: 2010-01-13 11:32 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-14 12:14 am (UTC)
philippos42: zat's bunny (comedy)
From: [personal profile] philippos42
Oh please. I read Hawkworld. I sort of enjoyed it, except where they tried to fit it into the DCU. Hawkman went wrong before this. (And I think alien Guy Gardner was better for DC's line than yet another Green Lantern.)

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] philippos42 - Date: 2010-01-20 12:56 am (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-14 01:42 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com
It did not.

It was never touched upon in the Threeboot. It's just that one panel in Zero Hour.

(no subject)

From: [personal profile] kamino_neko - Date: 2010-01-14 09:00 am (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 12:14 pm (UTC) - Expand

Date: 2010-01-14 02:23 am (UTC)
silverzeo: (Default)
From: [personal profile] silverzeo
You know, all those other Hawkmen outfits seem WAY cooler than the simple "He-Man" harness Carter has on....

Heh.

Date: 2010-01-14 09:13 am (UTC)
nefrekeptah: (Ride)
From: [personal profile] nefrekeptah
Extant: "I am Extant! I live outside your laws, your rules - your very conception of reality!

Starman (I think): "A chronal blast! Who is this guy?

Extant: "... I just said..."

Date: 2010-01-14 12:31 pm (UTC)
jlroberson: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jlroberson
>>This is it three characters became one 2 guys and woman ( which did make you wonder what was under the Hawk-god"'s loin cloth.

Whatever was under Rebis' bandages, I guess.

(no subject)

From: [identity profile] tahngarth.livejournal.com - Date: 2010-01-14 05:50 pm (UTC) - Expand

Profile

scans_daily: (Default)
Scans Daily
Founded by girl geeks and members of the slash fandom, [community profile] scans_daily strives to provide an atmosphere which is LGBTQ-friendly, anti-racist, anti-ableist, woman-friendly and otherwise discrimination and harassment free.

Bottom line: If slash, feminism or anti-oppressive practice makes you react negatively, [community profile] scans_daily is probably not for you.

Please read the community ethos and rules before posting or commenting.

July 2014

S M T W T F S
   1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 2829 3031  

Most Popular Tags

Style Credit

Expand Cut Tags

No cut tags