cyberghostface: (Juno)
[personal profile] cyberghostface posting in [community profile] scans_daily








What's all the fuss about?

When an internet message board troll who has practically made Didio-bashing a profession gets written into a DC Comics issue to be beaten and embarrassed, I think the people who published that product should be more ashamed than the target.

Honestly.

"Harold Winer".

Who goes on to become "Herald".

A shot at a message board poster who obsesses over D-level and lesser characters on the 'net, with the user name of Herald.

Who happens to be black just like the character in the book.

Who has gotten into arguments with DC Comics creators and had one say that he is well known in the DC offices, where he is regularly laughed at.

Sadly, if you remove this thinly veiled shot at a reader from the equation, the writing involved in making this "Harold Winer" character is even worse. But the thought process behind actually using 5 pages (and possibly more to come) to take a shot at a hater is just impossible for me to come to grips with.

We want to argue that the online fan presence is a vocal minority, right? I've actually started to embrace that idea more over the last year. But when members within that group can have such an effect on you that you have to devote pages to taking them down? Makes me wonder how much the people behind the scenes believe it.

Source

Seriously, how pathetic and immature is that? This is just like Joe Quesada inventing a Spider-Man villain called Dr. Box who tries to shrink Spider-Man's penis.

creator: dan didio,creator: don kramer,publisher: dc comics,title: outsiders
Page 1 of 2 << [1] [2] >>

Date: 2010-05-04 03:03 am (UTC)
punishermax: (Default)
From: [personal profile] punishermax
WATCH OUT WONDER WOMAN! YOUR NEW VILLAIN, FARTSMELLER445 WILL CHANGE THE FACE OF COMICS!

NOW BEAT UP THAT JERK FOR MAKING FUN OF ME ON WOW AND CALLING ME GAY

Date: 2010-05-04 03:06 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] kd_the_movie
Really if I was the "Herald" i'd have the greatest sense of satisfaction. A lowly internet poster out of millions gets to DC so much that Didio makes him a character in a book?

Date: 2010-05-04 03:13 am (UTC)
kashmirkong: He don't! (batman dont dance)
From: [personal profile] kashmirkong
Exactly. What Dido's done is told every troll on the internet that if you push their buttons the right way, they'll put you in a comic.

He's given them incentive if nothing else.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:19 am (UTC)
crinos: (Default)
From: [personal profile] crinos
I shudder to think what manner of evil scheme is currently being hatched in the depths of 4chan.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:27 am (UTC)
okkult3000: (Default)
From: [personal profile] okkult3000
I think you mean Ebaumsworld.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:47 am (UTC)
foxhack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] foxhack
I thought that site stopped being relevant ten years ago.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:40 pm (UTC)
nezchan: Navis at breakfast (Default)
From: [personal profile] nezchan
They actually plan things at 4chan?

I always thought it was "hey mob, let's go break something!" and they do.

Yep.

Date: 2010-05-04 11:06 pm (UTC)
thepinkperil: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thepinkperil
This my thought as well. But to be fair Herold is a very squeaky wheel. :D

Date: 2010-05-04 03:10 am (UTC)
chipsnopotatoes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] chipsnopotatoes
I'm sorry, I don't know the history of Herald and Dan, but I had to laugh at the first panel. Somehow, I can't imagine Didio writing the words "fashionista revolution" in his story. (I've not read anything else he's written btw)

Also, looks like they missed a typo there. When Lia talks to her asst about getting rid of the other woman, she says "Remindes..." instead of "Reminds..."

Date: 2010-05-04 03:15 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] zordboy
"Didio Sinks to a New Low???"

Okay, my first reaction to that is, he had anywhere to go?

And there is still a serious issue here. It's all very well to right-off the complaints of whiny, obsessive fans -- but dismissing *every* complaint in this way makes you look ridiculously unprofessional. And also makes you teeter dangerous close to "You suck. Now give me your money for a product where I can insult you more". And it's just, so much fail. So much.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:21 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] zordboy
"Write-off", not "right-off". I'm tired, leave me alone. :)

Date: 2010-05-04 01:48 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: b/w (Default)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Okay, my first reaction to that is, he had anywhere to go?

That's the thing with believing that someone has hit the rock bottom, isn't it? They're bound to whip out a shovel and start building a subway.

Date: 2010-05-04 09:29 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
Of course, it is hard to find legit complaints in a seas of trolls.

Date: 2010-05-05 01:01 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] zordboy
If you wind the trolls back to base-level, there was probably something suss there that kicked off their trolling. And DC's done some pretty shitty things the last few years, so it's really, really hard to side with Didio on this one.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:18 am (UTC)
big_daddy_d: (Default)
From: [personal profile] big_daddy_d
Actually I believe it's not that different from Quesada and the Spidey Brain Trust considering how they take their share of shots at those of us who are anti-One More Day/Brand New Day. Not to mention how they admitted to getting off on pissing off us fans and it's like..yeaa..purposely pissing off fans..that only works if you're a professional wrestler turned heel, because at least then fans still love and respect you. So yea..to be disrespectful on such a degree..wow. A lot of creators, and hell even entertainers of any sort, they forget that when all is said and done..fans make...or break you. If your work is crap, they will let you know. if they love it, they will let you know. A lot of them seem to forget this. I'm done with this rant..

Date: 2010-05-04 03:34 am (UTC)
big_daddy_d: (Default)
From: [personal profile] big_daddy_d
Hey, you bring up a good point, but the fact that you said "Yet".. can't help but wonder how long until we see them do the same thing.

And is that Ellen Paige with a pipe?

Date: 2010-05-04 03:39 pm (UTC)
nezchan: Batman smoking a corncob pipe, 'cuz he's so awesome (corncob)
From: [personal profile] nezchan
I'm not big on smoking, but a pipe can make just about anyone look awesome.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:54 am (UTC)
domino_blue: (Default)
From: [personal profile] domino_blue
Well I will give B and D credit on something they know how to flog a dead horse until you just don't care anymore. But moving on Dan in general is just not a very good writer....and this isn't even that great of a take that to anyone it just kind of point's how immature he is, and how bad a write he is, I mean okay superboy prime is a take that but good writers can make you know work this is just well...more fodder to complain about.

Date: 2010-05-04 09:34 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
They won't. This is a Didio thing.

Date: 2010-05-04 09:32 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
That's hardly the same.

And if fans are being jerks, they should expect people to be jerks to them too.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:22 am (UTC)
punishermax: (Default)
From: [personal profile] punishermax
Look if they just would stop complaining they wouldn't be turned into imaginary characters that get beat up by super heroes.

They knew the risks.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:22 am (UTC)
big_daddy_d: (Default)
From: [personal profile] big_daddy_d
Now on the other hand..to look at this in a possitive light.. whoever this Harold guy is... dude, at least you got drawn into a comic, which I'm sure is a personal wish among any of us. Also..Veritas..isn't that the name of that Illuminati-like group in Smallville?

One more thing though..why does he look like Steve Urkel?

Date: 2010-05-04 03:24 am (UTC)
punishermax: (Default)
From: [personal profile] punishermax
Counterpoint: He was drawn in a Dan Didio book

Date: 2010-05-04 03:25 am (UTC)
big_daddy_d: (Default)
From: [personal profile] big_daddy_d
Lol

Date: 2010-05-04 03:30 am (UTC)
shadowpsykie: Information (Default)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
i like dann Didio books..... am i the only one?

Date: 2010-05-04 03:35 am (UTC)
arbre_rieur: (Hey Kids! Comics!)
From: [personal profile] arbre_rieur
Not a book, but his time on the TV show Reboot has quite a number of fans, I believe.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:28 am (UTC)
okkult3000: (Default)
From: [personal profile] okkult3000
Beast Wars fans, on the other hand...

Date: 2010-05-04 01:42 pm (UTC)
galateus: Zuko facepalms. (facepalm zuko)
From: [personal profile] galateus
Now you made me curious--Aw crap, Beast Machines was part HIM?

I have a name to put with the blame now.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:55 am (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Count me in on the ReBoot love!

Date: 2010-05-04 03:28 am (UTC)
shadowpsykie: (ask the questions)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
I don't get it.... i mean i know who everyone is assuming it is... don't think there is anyone online who dosent know who Herald is.

but there was a Herald before the internet "troll,"

but ae we forgetting Mal Duncan? Mal Duncan was the first Herald.

also isnt this Herald gay? (meaning Harold Winer?)

Date: 2010-05-04 03:39 am (UTC)
suzene: (Default)
From: [personal profile] suzene
also isnt this Herald gay? (meaning Harold Winer?)

Assuming that it actually is a deliberate swipe at an internet poster, I wouldn't be surprised if that was intended to be an extra layer of insult. The level of maturity needed to take that sort of potshot in the first place wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility.

Date: 2010-05-04 11:50 am (UTC)
wizardru: Hellboy (Default)
From: [personal profile] wizardru
I've never heard of this 'Herald' dude...but then I never hang around Newsarama or similar forums. SD is the only comics forum I visit with anything resembling regularity.

And not being a Titans fan of any size, I'd only heard of Mal Duncan once or twice. I certainly wouldn't have remembered him as Herald, though Didio clearly does.

Date: 2010-05-04 02:04 pm (UTC)
phosfate: (Default)
From: [personal profile] phosfate
Never heard of him before.

Date: 2010-05-04 02:54 pm (UTC)
ruhig_knight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] ruhig_knight
but ae we forgetting Mal Duncan? Mal Duncan was the first Herald.

True, I thought of him immediately after reading this too. But now he's known as 'Vox' and is in limbo at this moment, so the 'Herald' name is up for grabs. Plus, since he's a Titans character it's probably the best he stays in limbo; so far he's only got maimed and an off panel divorce.

Date: 2010-05-04 07:32 pm (UTC)
protogarrett: (Default)
From: [personal profile] protogarrett
I have no idea what any of you are talking about. Can I get some backstory on who this guy is? I am confused.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:34 am (UTC)
arbre_rieur: (Hey Kids! Comics!)
From: [personal profile] arbre_rieur
I don't know... Considering DC already has this guy, complete with horn, this might have nothing to do with the Internet poster. The surname "Winer" does give me pause, though.

Was there anything in the new character's behavior that resembled the fan Herald?

Date: 2010-05-04 03:36 am (UTC)
sailorlibra: (pffft)
From: [personal profile] sailorlibra
There are definitely worse fates. I mean, getting drawn into a comic book as a sympathetic, if ineffectual villain? I'd be okay with that. You may call me the Pink Penguin and my motivation is turning crazy after being stranded in the North Pole.* I can be the minor nuisance in Black Canary's hair for about ten minutes on an off day.

*I know, okay?

Date: 2010-05-04 09:23 pm (UTC)
leikomgwtfbbq: (Default)
From: [personal profile] leikomgwtfbbq
I know, right? I'd love to be an ineffectual goofy villain or something. XD

Date: 2010-05-04 03:44 am (UTC)
thanekos: Kouhei " Principal Garren " Hayami, the Libra Zodiarts, is bugged. (Default)
From: [personal profile] thanekos
Harry Winer.

hee.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:57 am (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
I often say "Because Dan DiDio hates you, that's why." I'm not sure it's an Internet meme yet, but we can hope. I doubt I'll get a character named after me.

Although... there was that line in FINAL CRISIS where someone says "There is a god... and he hates us." Of course, they were talking about Darkseid, and I don't equate Dan DiDio with Darkseid... yet.

Date: 2010-05-04 04:15 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] aegof
..It's not too hard to do, what with all the villains being easily read as Things That Are Wrong With Superhero Comics Today.

Date: 2010-05-08 01:11 pm (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
Could you elaborate on that? I know the Infinite Crisis villains were like that. But how were the Blackest Night villains or more modern villains?

Date: 2010-05-08 07:47 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] aegof
I'm sorry; I was talking specifically about Final Crisis. Most of the bad guys there can be seen as representatives of an archetype that is considered Dark and Mature. They attract a ton of followers, and the nastier ones literally tear down the narrative just by existing.

As leader of the Bad Guys, you could, if determined to do so, read Darkseid as DiDio.

Date: 2010-05-04 04:18 am (UTC)
nezchan: Navis at breakfast (Default)
From: [personal profile] nezchan
Because Darkseid has standards?

Date: 2010-05-04 04:21 am (UTC)
nezchan: Navis at breakfast (Default)
From: [personal profile] nezchan
What does it say when the only nearly sympathetic character in those scans is the one who they're taking a "shot" at? Seriously, everyone else is an asshole, no wonder he's bitter.

Date: 2010-05-04 04:25 am (UTC)
jelly_ace: (chin)
From: [personal profile] jelly_ace
What a story to tell the grandkids! I pissed off the DC Editor-in-Chief so much I made it to his comic book.

Date: 2010-05-04 04:56 am (UTC)
kashmirkong: Batman in a bowler hat. (Default)
From: [personal profile] kashmirkong
I bet Dave Lizewski and the guy that spent $8500 to have his name in Nemesis are kicking themselves right now. At least the money went to charity.

Spider Jerusalem was right though: being a bastard works.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:03 am (UTC)
jelly_ace: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jelly_ace
being a bastard works

Doesn't it always? ;)

Date: 2010-05-04 04:52 am (UTC)
goggle_kid: (Pretty Cure WTF?)
From: [personal profile] goggle_kid

Date: 2010-05-04 04:57 am (UTC)
kashmirkong: Good call, baby doll! (kickass cage)
From: [personal profile] kashmirkong
Congratulations! You're in the next issue now.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:35 am (UTC)
goggle_kid: (Default)
From: [personal profile] goggle_kid
I am?

Ah dang it.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:11 am (UTC)
kusonaga: (Gene Genie)
From: [personal profile] kusonaga
I don't see it. Sure, "Winer", but Herald's a character and concept that has been around a long time in the DCU, much longer than this troll has been. Heck, how many people online call themselves Herald? Give me a break, this sounds like somebody reading into things.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:55 am (UTC)
grimmbear: (Default)
From: [personal profile] grimmbear
agreed. This is the updated Mal Duncan.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:26 am (UTC)
ladyinred52: (Happily Ever After)
From: [personal profile] ladyinred52
Admittedly, the poster Herald always annoyed me to death, but if this is true, it is a little extreme.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:44 pm (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
I'd be interested in reading some of his posts, if you could point us toward them. (If not, no big whoop.)

Date: 2010-05-04 06:05 pm (UTC)
ladyinred52: (Default)
From: [personal profile] ladyinred52
He posted a lot at the 'Rama, and some at the Outhouse. My main interaction with him, or at least seeing his posts, was at the former.

I think he may have posted at the old scans_daily. He was obsessed with the female Dr. Light.

Date: 2010-05-04 08:32 pm (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
Thanks. Someone on Box's LJ posted a link to one of the threads that he participated in; he has a rather high, not-particularly-justified view of himself and his witty repartee. I can completely believe that DiDio based this guy on him.

Date: 2010-05-04 05:39 am (UTC)
crabby_lioness: (Default)
From: [personal profile] crabby_lioness
Internet Rule #1:

DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS!

Date: 2010-05-04 05:56 am (UTC)
stubbleupdate: (Default)
From: [personal profile] stubbleupdate
When I read through this, I thought "this is a bit of a big reaction because somebody can't spell "reminds""

Date: 2010-05-04 06:03 am (UTC)
halloweenjack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] halloweenjack
This is just like Joe Quesada inventing a Spider-Man villain called Dr. Box who tries to shrink Spider-Man's penis.

I'm pretty sure that Box would laugh until he cried if this happened.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:50 am (UTC)
foxhack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] foxhack
Or he would happily retire to a home in the boonies.

Date: 2010-05-04 12:47 pm (UTC)
bluepard: A creepy grinning woman from the student film "Smile" (Horror Grin)
From: [personal profile] bluepard
I would too, especially if the attack involved this song

(By which I mean that Box's gimmick would be putting penises in boxes, not in himself. Just to clarify.)

Date: 2010-05-04 06:04 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] theanswer
I think this is more based on Mal Duncan.

Date: 2010-05-04 06:54 am (UTC)
grimmbear: (Default)
From: [personal profile] grimmbear
Yeah, pre-crisis Mal was given his horn just like this but it was actually Gabriel who gave it to him and it could summon the Titans from anywhere they were to Mal's side (among other things).

Date: 2010-05-04 06:52 am (UTC)
foxhack: (Default)
From: [personal profile] foxhack
Gosh darnit.

If this is so, then where's my Liefeldized persona?

Or Greg Land, has he traced a taxidermied fox yet? :p

Date: 2010-05-04 09:25 pm (UTC)
leikomgwtfbbq: (Roffle)
From: [personal profile] leikomgwtfbbq
Man, now I totally want to see Land try his hand at furry art.

Just to see what happens.

Date: 2010-05-05 01:08 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] zordboy
I'd buy an issue. *nods*

Date: 2010-05-05 04:59 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
Heck, having it be a furry would mean he wouldn't have to trace it, making his art better--like what happened recently with Worlock in New Mutants.

Date: 2010-05-04 08:12 am (UTC)
akodo_rokku: (Default)
From: [personal profile] akodo_rokku
Y'know all things considered, a Dr. Box story is not all that far-fetched.

Date: 2010-05-04 11:10 pm (UTC)
kashmirkong: Batman in a bowler hat. (Default)
From: [personal profile] kashmirkong
Especially since Marvel and DC rip off each others ideas to no end.

Date: 2010-05-04 12:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daningram.insanejournal.com
DC's instituted a policy wherein a biological relationship to anyone evil makes that person evil.

Frankly, I'd say they've hitten rock bottom with that. This is nothin'.

Date: 2010-05-04 03:22 pm (UTC)
jaybee3: Nguyen Lil Cass (Default)
From: [personal profile] jaybee3
The sad thing is that even IF this wasn't a pot-shot at a specific reader when you combine it with Superboy-Prime who was turned from a heroic character into an whining strawman fanboy just so GJ can make a point and combined with the reaction to Lian Harper's death (where DC seems to think because fans were disgusted and emotional about killing off a kid, it was a good story, so they dismiss complaints about it), the automatic assumption is that it IS a pot-shot until proven otherwise.

Combine this with Marvel's Braintrust continually needling and being obnoxious to those who dislike BND, and you have to wonder. In an world where the comics readership is shrinking and aging, why do the people in charge of these companies (both of whom now have mega-corporate bottom-line overlords) do their best to alientate the readership they have left. It's so childish.

Date: 2010-05-04 07:09 pm (UTC)
liliaeth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] liliaeth
Yeah, I don't get that one either, before OMD I would have happily gotten the next generation of my family into comics. I would have bought Spidey stuff for my goddaughter, bought comics for my godson and done anything in my power to get both of them interested in Spidey and comics in general. Thanks to BND and the people involved's behavior around it, my cousin is now 16 and has no interest in comics and will never buy one, because I stopped offering him comics to read. at a time when it could have gotten him into them.

My goddaughter will now not be raised with Spidey toys, I won't even get her into Marvel Adventures, cause I wouldn't want her too disappointed later on. (that and I don't trust Marvel, esp with the reboot of Marvel Adventures)

In other words, their attitude hasn't just lost them one reader, it has lost them all the kids I could have gotten into comics as well.And I'm sure I'm not the only (god)parent, aunt, uncle, cousin, older brother/sister, ... who thinks this way.

Date: 2010-05-04 09:39 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
But not everyone. There are plenty that don't care and keep reading and giving it to family members.

Date: 2010-05-04 09:41 pm (UTC)
thehood: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehood
Maybe, but if the fanboys actually gave good complaints and not fanboy whining, they might listen.

Date: 2010-05-05 02:43 am (UTC)
liliaeth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] liliaeth
The problem with that is that no matter what complaint fanboys and fangirls have, the guys in charge of Marvel don't listen to any of them. the only thing they don't see as whining is if you praise them 100%, with the possible exception of a colour misprint. And considering just how badly written; and how out of character thier writing is, there really is a huge deal to complain about.

And no, I don't complain easily. I was still being positive through most of Civil War, I liked huge parts of the clone saga. In short, under normal circumstances, I'd be a marvel zombie who'd accept close to anything. Even Sins past was something I could easily ignore as just a few easily forgettable badly written issues.

The problem with BND and Dark Reign to me is that they destroy Spidey and Marvel to the core. To a point where the only way to deal with it, is to burn it with fire.

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