scans_daily: Rogues Gallery Revamp

colonel_green (

scans_daily,
@ 2010-10-31 02:57 pm UTC

Entry tags:

char: cyclops/scott summers, char: human torch/johnny storm, char: invisible woman/susan storm, char: sub-mariner/namor mckenzie, char: the thing/ben grimm, char: white queen/emma frost, creator: jonathan hickman, creator: steve epting, publisher: marvel comics, title: fantastic four

Rogues Gallery Revamp

Four scans from Fantastic Four #584.

Ben's human for a week a year, thanks to Val and the other nerd kids; the Thing reverting to his human form has been an occasional development that can never last, but I think this is a neat conceit. Keeps him in his most recognizable form most of the time, but allows for you to do odd episodes of normalcy when you feel like it (though I forsee zealous fans keeping track of the number of times it happens and trying to game out based on that how many years have passed).

Anyway, Ben and Johnny hit the town: walking around with nobody staring, going to see the Giants lose, dining with Stan Lee and Jack Kirby, and playing poker with other superheroes (it seems like that last one is something he could do any time, but whatever), etc.

And then the evening is ruined with Hickman's diabolical revamp of one of the Four's greatest foes: the all-new, all-different Yancy Street Gang!

Later, Ben goes to Alicia's place to get laid.

Elsewhere, Sue, in her capacity as interlocutor between Regular Atlantis and Weird New Atlantis introduced a few issues ago, goes to accompany Namor to a meeting with the other kings. So it's off to Utopia!

Ah, Namor, smooth as ever.

Also, we need more Sue/Emma interaction.

If you had asked me for a list of five artists to draw the Fantastic Four, Steve Epting wouldn't have been on it, but I'm really liking his stint so far.

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	no subject livelovehump 2010-10-31 06:28 pm UTC (link)
	I can't be the only person who thinks Johnny Storm looks 40 in these right? Besides that. I thought it was a really good issue though. (Reply to this)

	no subject sir_razorback 2010-10-31 06:36 pm UTC (link)
	Running around at 2000 degrees all the time has got to be doing some serious damage to his pores. :p (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject lucky_gamble 2010-10-31 06:41 pm UTC (link)
	Ah Sue, why do you resist Namor? And yes, Sue and Emma need have a scene where they both want the same cute blouse at a Macy's sale and are on their period. (Reply to this)

	no subject thanekos 2010-10-31 06:46 pm UTC (link)
	New England gangsters wish they were those guys. though I'd think you'd need something more along the lines of a nuclear bomb and several years following to make a gang like that happen. (Reply to this)

	no subject book_of_daniel 2010-10-31 06:53 pm UTC (link)
	Emma's worst nightmare: a power set like Susan's that would remove her from the center of attention when activated. (Reply to this)

	no subject darkblade 2010-10-31 06:56 pm UTC (link)
	It really says a lot when I can accept Atlantis, an island full of mutants going to war against vampires, astronauts getting superpowers from cosmic rays but can not accept a street gang of former Wall Street, white collar criminals. (Reply to this)

	no subject valtyr 2010-10-31 07:08 pm UTC (link)
	There are so many things that little exchange of glances between Sue and Emma could mean. Sue went to Emma's birthday party in Heralds, right? So they're friends. (Although Scott arranged for that, so why would he be saying 'you know Emma'... gah.) (Reply to this)

	no subject taggerung301 2010-10-31 07:32 pm UTC (link)
	I really am quite curious as to what that whole exchange meant I wonder if they'll elaborate on that or if it will just be a brief little weird moment (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject arilou_skiff 2010-10-31 07:33 pm UTC (link)
	IIRC he arranged with someone (Monica? She-Hulk? Not sure) to arrange the party. There were also mentions that this gang wasn't the people Emma usually hung out with. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject twomasks 2010-10-31 07:35 pm UTC (link)
	If they weren't dressed to the nines and talking that financial jive, they might be interesting. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

no subject

jaybee3
2010-10-31 08:20 pm UTC (link)

Maybe I'm the only one who likes Reed and Sue (even when he's being a dick)? Namor has always seemed to me very douche-ish and (naturally given his position) entitled. For instance I think Fraction once said that one of the (but not only) reasons he's sticking around Utopia is to try to get into Emma's pants again despite her loyalty to Scott. And back a decade ago when Reed was "dead" (though Sue didn't believe it), Namor instantly attached himself to the FF to "help" the grieving widow (with even Ben and Johnny calling him out on it).

(Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

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jaybee3
2010-10-31 08:25 pm UTC (link)

I wouldn't mind them drawing Johnny older if only they would have him (regularly) act older as well (sadly I think Johnny is the one Hickman's going to kill off). Epting is very good (would have preferred he stay on Captain America though) yet he's another of those artists who can't seem to draw kids right (in a book where the kids are very important characters). In a scene where Sue was saying goodbye to Franklin and Val, both of the kids were the SAME HEIGHT. Despite Val being 4 at most and and Franklin being somewhere between 8-10 when she was born (which would make him 12-14 now).

(Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

no subject

jaybee3
2010-10-31 08:35 pm UTC (link)

If it's Emma vs Sue, I'm on Team Sue all the way. She really is the Alpha-Female of the MU and the one everybody else turns to. Sue's "realness" is very much a contrast to Emma's purposeful affectations (and I'm not just talking about her faux-British accents or faux-breasts). Emma might have seen herself as a match for Jean but not for Sue (example - try to imagine what Sue would do an Emma who made a play for Reed the way she did with Scott or tried to get Franklin/Val as students in the same way she "tried" with Kitty Pryde).

Despite the fact that Marvel Writers seem to want to go the Sue/Namor flirtation route ALL THE FRIGGIN TIME despite her always saying no - something seemingly Hickman is even doing next issue despite the fact he had "Franklin" and "Valeria" mock the very idea in one of past issues letter columns, I think Sue has been written very well in recent years (contrasted especially with Emma who has been turned into a more sexualized blond version of Jean). Hickman himself pointed out Sue's importance (and it was also one of the lone interesting ideas coming out of Civil War) where we've been shown that without Sue, Reed pretty much loses much of his humanity and seeks to re-shape the world as he sees it. She holds him back.

(Reply to this)

	no subject stubbleupdate 2010-10-31 08:40 pm UTC (link)
	I'm almost certain that Emma Frost and Sue hung out in MK4 (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject stubbleupdate 2010-10-31 08:47 pm UTC (link)
	Yes. She Hulk, She-Thing, Alicia Masters, Emma and Sue all hung out for one night. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject thandrak 2010-10-31 09:39 pm UTC (link)
	I like Cyclops' outfit, with the asymmetrical shoulder piping. (Reply to this)

	no subject cleome45 2010-10-31 10:15 pm UTC (link)
	[rolleyes] Uh, yeah. Right. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject schala_kid 2010-10-31 10:37 pm UTC (link)
	Digging the fact that Emma and Sue have different shades of blonde with Emma being platinum and Sue more golden. Also why is ben human again? I haven't been reading FF4. Can he turn to the Thing at will now? (Reply to this)

no subject

jlbarnett
2010-10-31 10:45 pm UTC (link)

This gives me a chance to complain about some stuff I've been meaning to complain about for a while.

Namor's feelings for Sue were something that gave a normal jerkass a reason to show some basic decency and was a real positive. But this thing he has going with Emma, and the fact there was even something with his cousin Namora really sucks. Now it seems like he'll hit on any blond with big boobs.

I really can't stand the multiple cities. Especially with a new Atlantis that really seems to have nothing properly to do with the real MU Atlantis. And Alien Inhumans! There was never anything human about them, unlike the Ihumans ancestors. And Marvel has a way to create aliens that are a little off from races they normally have. The Celestials created Deviants on multiple planets.

I'm actually starting to prefer my own ideas to some of the stuff being put out now.

(Reply to this)

	no subject thatnickguy 2010-11-01 12:54 am UTC (link)
	As of this issue, yeah. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject thatnickguy 2010-11-01 12:55 am UTC (link)
	-Namor macking on Sue -Ben cured again -Galactus/Silver Surfer I've been wanting to try Hickman's run for awhile, but when I flipped through this latest issue, it felt like a LOT of retreads of the same old FF stories that have been told from the beginning. (Reply to this)

no subject

jjgalahad
2010-11-01 01:11 am UTC (link)

Due to the new group of Science Kids deciding to make Ben their first project, they managed to sort of "cure" Ben.

It turns out he should have always been able to turn it off and on like Johnny but since he's spent so much time in the "On" position, he's only able to turn it off again for one random week of the year after drinking the Science Kids' Science Juice. This was his first yearly week.

(Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject arbre_rieur 2010-11-01 02:16 am UTC (link)
	This reminds me of something Mark Waid says he told Tom Brevoort when he began writing Fantastic Four. It was along the line of, "If I ever turn in a script where Reed's performing a lab experiment, only for it get to get interrupted by Ben and Johnny fighting, and then Sue breaks it up, FIRE ME." (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

no subject

baihu
2010-11-01 03:22 am UTC (link)

I like Reed/Sue due to the fact I have a 'thing' for married/canon couples (ironically a much harder fandom to keep than regular fanshipping). Buuut, Reed tends to be douchery, and I never really felt the relationship was a in a good spot. Maybe considering it was created in an era where well, Sue's power of invisibility had other connotations.

Hence why I really really really love Reed/Sue in Ultimate FF (before all the shit hit the giant fans so to speak, I can't read Ultimates anything any more, which is a huge pity). But yeah, I guess it was because Reed was such a cute sciency goofball, and Sue was more sexually aggressive and just as brilliant as he is but in a different field. And in Ultimates, Reed nearly smacks UltimatesNamor around with a giant subconscious giantess version of Sue's mom in her underwear. I mean, that's just a bizarre level of badassness.

(Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject stubbleupdate 2010-11-01 07:20 am UTC (link)
	No he can't. He can be 'human' for a week a year. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject tzipwich 2010-11-01 10:20 am UTC (link)
	Aren't there any female superheroes who actually get along with Emma? And maybe greet her with "Hi" instead of just her name? (Reply to this)

	no subject shadowpsykie 2010-11-01 08:08 pm UTC (link)
	they get along fairly well. Emma tends to be a little brash and both tend to think the other needs to lighten up in different ways, but other than that, they might not be besties... but they get along fine. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject bruinsfan 2010-11-01 08:11 pm UTC (link)
	Right there with you. Though I put it out of my mind because the rest of the Ben & Johnny story was so good. I may just tell myself that it was bunch of full-of-themselves stockbrokers who saw Boiler Room one too many times over microbrews and decided to hit the streets to continue the testosterone fest. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

	no subject skalja 2010-11-02 12:46 am UTC (link)
	I don't think Steve Epting is capable of drawing someone younger than 30. (Reply to this) (Thread from start) (Parent)

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