Date: 2010-11-28 12:21 am (UTC)
q99: (Default)
From: [personal profile] q99
Does it mentioned Wonder Woman's "death" that happened around that era?

Date: 2010-11-28 12:51 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] jlbarnett
I'm not 100% sure but the Wonder Woman that died around this time was Artemis. Diana, the well known and respected Wonder Woman, didn't die until Superman gained electirc powers.

In fact unless Diana announced it I'm not sure anyone would know Artemis died as opposed to Diana just taking her job back.

Date: 2010-11-28 12:55 am (UTC)
bluefall: (mellow Donna)
From: [personal profile] bluefall
No mention of Diana's death, but there wouldn't be - it happened during the Electric Blue Kool-Aid Supes era, and this issue ends with the Doomsday fight.

The issue did, however, spend enough time on AzBats that the omission of Temi's tenure is kind of weird. I'm willing to forgive a fair amount of Wonder-slighting in this series, though, since the narrator named his kid Diana in her honor.

Date: 2010-11-28 12:57 am (UTC)
q99: (Default)
From: [personal profile] q99
-No mention of Diana's death, but there wouldn't be - it happened during the Electric Blue Kool-Aid Supes era, and this issue ends with the Doomsday fight.-

Ah, that makes sense.

Date: 2010-11-28 01:12 am (UTC)
althechi: (batman)
From: [personal profile] althechi
"I will[...]be rid of Batman forever!"

Be my guest, Bane. =P

Date: 2010-11-28 02:26 am (UTC)
nezchan: And he can breathe in space (grinch-man)
From: [personal profile] nezchan
And if you could do something about Batman and Robin while you're at it, that'd be super.

Date: 2010-11-28 05:10 am (UTC)
darkblade: (Default)
From: [personal profile] darkblade
Yeah you'd think he'd take that one more personally.

Date: 2010-11-28 08:08 am (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
It has Chris O'Donnell in spandex and some sort of leatherlike material (as well as tying him up and gagging him in a deathtrap)... so it gets a pass from me.

Date: 2010-11-28 01:28 am (UTC)
misterbug: (Default)
From: [personal profile] misterbug
...What, NICE agents of the FBI? That's an interesting trend to buck...

Date: 2010-11-28 08:57 am (UTC)
badficwriter: Flying saucer-I WANT TO BELIEVE (Default)
From: [personal profile] badficwriter
They're detectives.

Date: 2010-11-28 02:46 am (UTC)
shanejayell: (Default)
From: [personal profile] shanejayell
Wasn't Batman attacked in his mansion? Or is that a seperate thing?

Date: 2010-11-28 04:01 am (UTC)
pyrotwilight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] pyrotwilight
He was. But I believe Bruce battled him continuously until they got outside and when he lost and was exhausted Bane took him to the top of a building to "break him".

Date: 2010-11-28 06:07 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Sorry, but I'm afraid you are quite wrong. The fight took place down in the Batcave, which is where Bane did the dirty deed. He then took the beaten Bats to the middle of Gotham and hurled him down into the crowd as depicted above, which may be what you were thinking of.

Date: 2010-11-28 06:17 am (UTC)
pyrotwilight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] pyrotwilight
Ahhh. No wonder my brain's remembering wrong. That sounds so damn unbelievable. (Having fought super villains for a few days in a row, beaten like hell by Bane, back broken and then thrown off a building and still surviving)

Thanks for that!

Date: 2010-11-28 06:22 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Well, he's just BARELY surviving - Alfred and Tim have to put him on life support immediately and pull strings to make sure he's not paralyzed for life.
You're welcome.

Date: 2010-11-28 11:25 am (UTC)
espanolbot: (Default)
From: [personal profile] espanolbot
And in the end he had to be healed by a psychic, but the effort reverts her to babyhood.

Date: 2010-11-28 05:40 pm (UTC)
bluefall: Wonder Girl facepalming (facepalm Cassie)
From: [personal profile] bluefall
That's.... um. Wow. How did I never realize how completely gross that is until I saw that written out like that.

Date: 2010-11-28 09:04 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
I have no idea, it's appalled me for years.

Date: 2010-11-28 10:34 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Especially since said psychic was quite a cool supporting character and potential love interest for Bruce. I wish one of these days, mainstream comics would stop being such wimps about interracial relationships - it's long since passed the point (I hope) where it would be controversial. A black guy hooking up with a white woman is fine, apparently - view Luke Cage and Jessica Jones - but a black woman hooking up with a white guy still seems to be taboo for some reason (at any rate, I can't think of any in-comics examples). Why is that, do you think? It's weird.

Date: 2010-11-28 10:43 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Well there's Misty Knight and Danny Rand for one.

Date: 2010-11-28 10:48 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Riiiiiiiight right right right - I'd forgotten that one; thanks. Still, 'white man, black woman' relationships are far less common in comics than ones the other way around.

Date: 2010-11-28 10:28 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Right - although I haven't read that one yet, just heard of it. Has that part of the story been collected in trades yet, know you?

Date: 2010-11-29 01:58 am (UTC)
espanolbot: (Default)
From: [personal profile] espanolbot
The third Knightfall trade I think... not sure if it's still in print.

Date: 2010-11-29 02:59 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Nah, I own that one - it's all about Bruce getting in fighting shape again and facing Az-Bats, and takes place AFTER he's out of the wheelchair. I think the part of the story it skips over is termed 'Knightquest', so it may be in a separate volume.

Date: 2010-11-28 04:02 am (UTC)
pyrotwilight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] pyrotwilight

Date: 2010-11-28 06:09 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
The timeline here is all wonky. Batman got beaten by Bane AFTER Supes was killed, not before. He was wearing a black armband from Superman's funeral in the first issue of 'Knightfall'.

Date: 2010-11-28 05:44 pm (UTC)
bluefall: Babs, looking grumpy and unimpressed (Babs is a grump)
From: [personal profile] bluefall
Well, they also smushed John's first day as a Green Lantern into this same short time period (the start of which is marked by Barbara's shooting what, eighteen years later?), so I guess they figured a few more liberties wouldn't hurt.

Date: 2010-11-28 10:44 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Except that that doesn't directly contradict the story involved here. Superman's death was a huge deal which arguably occasioned the concept for 'Knightfall' in the first place - 'as long as we're killing off Supes, lets break Bats'. This is a Superman/Batman story, and mucking up the order of things like that when it's so well-documented - the armband aside, Bats showed up at Superman's funeral and made several other appearances in the Super-books at the time to underline the tragedy of things - is just stupid. Arguably, having just gotten back from such a draining experience when Arkham went bye-bye is one of the reasons why he wasn't at his best in the first place.

Date: 2010-11-29 01:57 pm (UTC)
bluefall: Babs, looking grumpy and unimpressed (Babs is a grump)
From: [personal profile] bluefall
I don't know, I think the fact that Hard-Traveling Heroes happened more than a decade prior to TKJ is pretty well documented too, and I'd consider both events a pretty big deal in comics - much bigger than Knightfall for sure. This series isn't a Superman/Batman story, it's a DCU story, and putting major landmarks like "first black bearer of a major DC franchise" and "most famous fridging in DC history" that far out of sequence is pretty disorienting to anybody who knows the DCU even a little.

Date: 2010-11-29 02:32 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] psychopathicus_rex
Well, I must admit, I know very little about the start of John's career, so I'm not sure just how much of a jolt it made at the time. I wouldn't have said that it really belonged in a story like this - after all, John being the first black GL may have been significant in a number of ways, but when you get right down to it, it was simply the passing of a torch. I'm not sure it really compares with two of DC's most iconic heroes being turned into hamburger in public, ushering in a new era of turmoil.

Date: 2010-11-28 08:58 am (UTC)
badficwriter: Flying saucer-I WANT TO BELIEVE (Batman/Superman)
From: [personal profile] badficwriter
I gotta say, the backup story in this is insane.


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