I hope, if I have one redeeming feature...

[icon_uk]

it's that I can give credit where credit is due. I'm not a fan of much of Devin Grayson's output, but she can write a darn good character scene, Jim Lee tends to leave me unimpressed, but he can draw a darn pretty Dynamic Duo from time to time.

And so, in the interests of fairness and honesty I have to say that I liked this inteview up at newsarama

In which Judd Winick speaks about his forthcoming arc on Batman and Robin....

Nrama: But this Batman isn't Bruce. This is Dick. What are Jason's feelings about him?
Winick: Jason hates Dick Grayson. He's the good son; he's the one that worked out; he's the one that "Dad" loves best. For me, there's a philosophy behind Jason and Dick that I haven't had a chance to play out fully. I don't think it's going to play out in this story, because it's probably not the place for it. But I don't mind putting the philosophy out there:

One thing that haunts Jason is that he thinks if Dick Grayson who was the one that was about to die, Batman would have saved him.
And worse, if Dick Grayson was murdered, Jason knows that Batman would have killed Joker. He knows that in his heart.

The dark, dark thing for Jason is that he doesn't feel Bruce's refusal to take revenge on the Joker is just about Batman's morals and code that he won't break. He thinks it's about him. He thinks that if Dick Grayson was the one who was murdered, Batman would have definitely killed Joker.

Nrama: So what do Dick and Damian think of Jason as they are forced to kind of team-up with him in this story?

Well, you'll need to go to the interview page to read the answer to that, it's only fair to Newsarama. :)

That's a nice summation of Jason Todd's feelings for Bruce and Dick, and expressed more clearly than I think it has been shown in the comics (IMHO of course). Especially the notion that Jason is convinced that if Dick had died, Bruce WOULD have killed the Joker (The events in "Infinite Crisis" where Bruce pulls a gun on Alex Luthor sort of support that, depending on how you read the original scene) This actually makes me want to read the issues to see how it plays out. Kudos to Mr Winick for that.

For context, the cute, how Jason probably views the role of Robin (These were designed by one of my favourite artists Andy Price for Lego Batman T-shirt that alas, they only made in child sizes, because I would wear the hell out of any of them!)




For fun, the sublime, the history of the Robins, in animated form



Which originated here

And for legality, the ridiculous, in the form of a "Context is for the weak" from "Batman: The Cult"

Comments

[citygod]

Well, I know a child who is going to wear those shirts, if he wants to or not! Where can I get them?

[mrstatham]

In the UK, I've seen ones like those, or very similar, in the childrens clothing sections of Tesco.

[icon_uk]

I got these images off e-bay, so that might be your best shot.

Or there's Amazon, which has a few, including this one

[icon_uk]

Oh, and this one



Can be obtained in the UK from play.com in an adult size, but it's perhaps a little... disturbing.

[schala_kid]

I've seen them in Wal-Mart in the US

[hyperactivator]

interesting

[trafalgar]

The animated Robins (so cute!) is from here: http://kuromdbox.blog104.fc2.com/

Neat stuff. :)

[icon_uk]

Thank you, I'll add in a link to the main post. There's some seriously (and in some cases weirdly) cute stuff there! :)

[thehefner]

I've been revisiting The Cult ever since some people have used scans of that to dismiss my "Why Batman would never use a gun" scans from Seduction of the Gun. Man, what an ugly, disgusting relic. If there's a plus side to take away from that story, it's knowing that most Batman comics didn't grossly follow the worst traits of Dark Knight Returns Miller Batman to the extent that Starlin, Wrightson, and Wray did.

[icon_uk]

I confess I've never been a fan of "The Cult", for the very reasons you cite, like much of the era, it's trying to be like DKR whilst overlooking the fact that DKR worked because it was set in a notional future and so could get away with more.

I was stunned to realise that "The Cult" is still apparently in canon (Deacon Blackfire showed up as a Black Lantern)

It does have a nice scene or two with Jason as Robin being about as badass as he ever got to be, but the overall sub-DKR grotesquery of it put me off it big time (And I really hate having to say that about anything by Berni Wrightson, a genuinely awesome artist)

[darkknightjrk]

Oh yeah...for a second there I forgot all about the "guns" in The Cult--story-wise, it makes some sense, in that they're said in-story to be tranquilizer darts, and that Bruce and Jason had to go through an entire army.

[schala_kid]

I bought one of those Lego shirts in Large, I had to adjust it a little bit in the shoulder area since it was too large for me (every other part fit right or was tight, lol).

[icon_uk]

Unfortunately I'm over 6 feet tall, so I doubt I could wear one that didn't look embarrassing.

[whitesycamore]

How big are the large? I can fit into a boy's shirt aged 10-12 no problem, although, like you said, I do sometimes have an issue with the cut that seems made to fit those big square shoulders that they don't even have yet (wtf?) Still, I like my t-shirts figure-hugging as long as it doesn't distort the picture too much, and it's a way better solution than wearing a man's size small IMO.

I'd love to get the one with the sidekick reassembly image. Yeah, I think it sums up Jason's problem with the Tim-replacement quite succinctly!

[blackruzsa]

That is one cute animation.

[kurenai-tenka.livejournal.com]

I love that interview, and probably professed my love for Judd waaay too many times whilst reading it. :P

[icon_uk]

And by "professed your love" you mean..? Umm, you know what, on second thoughts, forget I asked that

;)

[aaron_bourque]

. . . . Batman did everything possible to save Jason Todd. Shut up Jason Todd.

Also, Batman did everything he could to kill the Joker immediately after you died, Jason Todd. Shut up, Jason Todd.

Finally, YOU ARE NOW ALIVE JASON TODD, SHUT THE FUCK UP JASON TODD.

[benicio127]

Ummmmm... how would Jason know all of this if no one has ever told him? Because no one, including Bruce, actually has. Ever. Soo.... since he can't read minds....

[darkknightjrk]

Well, you also have to remember that Jason Todd is pretty much legitimately nuts at this point.

[benicio127]

There has been some really great thoughts brought up on Tumblr about this, I'm just gonna point to "airawyn's comments, because she said some really great things.

I do think that Bruce loves all of his children, I'm not sure I'm entirely convinced he loves them *equally.* Maybe airawyn put it best when she said.... he loves them differently. But I definitely see where Jason is coming from.

Though... I'm not entirely sure about Dick. I mean, given everything that happened in continuity, I could see why Dick isn't a fan of Jason -- but I also see their relationship as being a lot more complex than that. Them both having a relationship prior to Jason's death and Dick feeling guilt over Jason's death (and return, too, probably, in that he hasn't been able to help him, because Dick helps everybody -- he hasn't given up on Damian, he didn't give up on Rose, etc.) So I just... don't think it's quite so simplistic. Maybe Winick really couldn't get into it in-depth in the interview....

But I think a lot of this makes Bruce, Dick and Jason very human -- I know families where the parents love the firstborn the most -- even when that firstborn has done some terrible things (in and out of jail, domestic abuse).

I'm glad Winick has more stories to tell about Jason because I certainly want to keep reading them. When I read his line saying that he couldn't say anything, I immediately thought: what a tease! I desperately want Jason to interact with the female members of the Batfamily: Babs, Steph and Cass. I don't think those relationships would be simplistic, either, and I really, really, really, really want to see him talk to Barbara. Can I stress that enough? Really, really, really, really, really, really, reaaaaaaaally want to see this happen. (I think it might be time to send in another letter to DC about this.... hahah)

And there's others I'd like to see him interact with, Alfred, Talia again, and Mia Dearden, definitely. I'd like for Mia to call him out on his bullshit and, given everything that's happened to her post-C4J (with her claiming Ollie's an enlightened hypocrite when he stopped her from killing the Electrocutioner) and at least get her to admit that, yeah, she does understand what he's talking about (since Arrows do have a different sense of morality than Bats, moreso Mia and Roy than, say, Connor) And that I think they are.... the only two (? I can't think of any others off the top of my head) street kids turned sidekicks, they have this sort of bond of understanding (plus Ollie's abandonment of her post C4J....) and that she doesn't represent the Bat and is therefore not *one of them* in Jason's eyes.

Whoops, this comment is way longer than I intended it to be, haha

[whitesycamore]

But I think a lot of this makes Bruce, Dick and Jason very human -- I know families where the parents love the firstborn the most -- even when that firstborn has done some terrible things (in and out of jail, domestic abuse).

Wait, is this some widely known thing where firstborns in particular tend to be favoured? Because most of the 'favourite' kids I know are younger siblings.

I still don't really feel that there's much evidence that Bruce loved Dick any more than Jason, at least pre-resurrection. He did the insta-adoption/guardianship thing with both of them, which while creepy, speaks to pretty strong feelings on his part. He lunged wildly at Joker with a machine gun in ADITF and did have serious intentions to kill him.

And - and - Jason is the plucky street kid who made Batman laugh in Crime Alley at his sheer audacity! Dude, come on now, that is powerful. But I absolutely believe that Jason might think it's true because he's so out of the loop, and also seems to have seriously distorted emotional thinking on that front - which I think might be because he's projecting his mother's betrayal onto the world somehow.

And on a personal level, I just don't get someone liking Dick more than Jason - although I heard it *can* happen... :P

THAT IS A GIANT STONE PENIS WITH A MAN'S FACE ON IT

[01d55]

53 comments on this post and I have yet to see any mention of Stonefacecock.

Re: THAT IS A GIANT STONE PENIS WITH A MAN'S FACE ON IT

[icon_uk]

We try not to mention the stonefacecock in the room....

Yeah, that actually surprised me too

[janegray]

I'm surprised Damian hates Jason so much. I had assumed that he and Jason would get along pretty well.

[icon_uk]

I imagine that in Damian's mind Jason is both hideously undisciplined AND disrespectful to his father, both are traits Damian despises.

And of coruse, the first/last time they met, Jason blew away a goodly chunk of Damians internal organs with a machine gun, including severing his spinal column. That's the sort of thing that can lead to the bearing of grudges.

[fifthie]

I pride myself on not giving credit when it is due to people who suck,

but UGH YOU WIN THIS ROUND WINICK, that was actually pretty good I guess.

...with the usual caveat that the reason Batman doesn't kill the Joker is he knows the Joker would just come back, probably with superstrength, or maybe vampire powers.

[proteus_lives]

Love that animated one. It's like an anime opening.

And that's a good thing.

[icon_uk]

It IS very... "dynamic", isn't it? :)