icon_uk: (Default)
[personal profile] icon_uk posting in [community profile] scans_daily
From here;

Here are a few samples from a retailer who attended the DC Retail launch on Friday

Why the change?
Dan started out explaining why DC was doing this. DC had taken a look at the comics industry as a whole and felt that the industry needed a shot in the arm. They felt that the stories had gotten stale and too talky. Dan recounted a book he read recently from ‘another publisher’ that had 15 pages of 9 panels of exposition. He felt comics used to be able to do stories that movies couldn’t. Lately, comic book movies have been doing comics better than comics have. Dan felt that DC needed to work harder across the board to improve the product. DC wants to publish books that are fresh and exciting that can compete with the level of action that fans are finding on TV, in movies and video games and elsewhere.

The end of "Writing for Trade"
Another change DC is making is that they won’t be ‘writing for the trade’ anymore. Writers have been told to write the story they want to write and not worry about the trade collecting. If they can tell a well-paced story in 4 issues, they’ve been told not to pad it to make it 6 issues. Editorial can worry about how it’s going to be collected.

If it ain't broke...
DC realized that some things were working fine. Based on sales, critical response and fan comments, they knew that Green Lantern and Batman weren’t ‘broken’. In approaching the re-launch, DC didn’t want to throw out the baby with the bathwater. They knew some things needed to be changed, but they didn’t want to lose the excitement behind what was working. Instead of a re-boot, they opted for a sliding re-launch. Continuity would be preserved and only where things weren’t working would there be changes. As such, there are are little to no changes in the Batman and Green Lantern books.

There are sections for all the various sub-categories on the link- Superman, Dark, Edge etc, here are a couple of the items of interest to us here;

Batman Family
Batgirl- Barbara Gordon is back as Batgirl. The events of Killing Joke and her tenure as Oracle have occurred and this title addresses her return to the role.

Birds of Prey- Barbara Gordon will still be part of the book.

Justice League Family
Justice League- The flagship title of the New 52. Jim Lee joked that if Geoff Johns had been there, Geoff would have said that he had always wanted to work with Jim. The three keywords here are Heart, Humor and Heroics. The first arc of this book takes place 5 years in the past and serves as a Year One story for the Justice League. In story, up until this point, there have been no ‘super-heroes’, just super powered individuals who have sometimes been viewed with suspicion. By banding together, the Justice League wants to show the world that they are deserving the moniker of super-hero.


Young Justice Family
Teen Titans- All four Robins star or co-star in a book. (I know, what about Stephanie Brown? It was hinted that we would see her in Batman Incorporated. Dan Didio said she worked better as Spoiler.) This book is Tim Drake’s showcase. There will be some synergy between this and Superboy.

And for legality, a reason why working for Two-Face might have it's little perks when you've just rendered Gotham's finest unconscious...



To borrow one of my favourite Xander quotes from Buffy "Hands! Hands in NEW PLACES!"

Date: 2011-06-27 08:35 pm (UTC)
espanolbot: (Default)
From: [personal profile] espanolbot
"It was hinted that we would see her in Batman Incorporated. Dan Didio said she worked better as Spoiler."



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Date: 2011-06-27 09:46 pm (UTC)
thokstar: Spot (Default)
From: [personal profile] thokstar
Given the context of the quote, it seems to me that Didio is claiming that Stephanie worked better as Spoiler than as Robin. Which is mostly true, even if only because of writer incompetence.

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Date: 2011-06-27 10:11 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] jlbarnett
If Jason can be Red Hood and Tim can be Red Robin and Cass can be Black Bat I am perfectly cool with Steph choosing to use the identity she created for herself to let someone else step into the Batgirl role.

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Date: 2011-06-27 08:37 pm (UTC)
darkblade: (Default)
From: [personal profile] darkblade
Dan recounted a book he read recently from ‘another publisher’ that had 15 pages of 9 panels of exposition.

Did they just use Bendis-Speak as part of their justification for the reboot?

Continuity would be preserved and only where things weren’t working would there be changes. As such, there are are little to no changes in the Batman and Green Lantern books.

How little can they show they care about fans of the female bat characters? Outright saying Oracle and Cass were "not working".

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Date: 2011-06-27 08:44 pm (UTC)
sigmund_droid: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sigmund_droid
I'll pretty much sum up my thoughts on the reboot.

DC:

We're hip! We're modern! We beileve in equality so we're giving all our women pants!

We're not that modern, Barbara Gordon's back everyone! Look we're traditional DC!

Date: 2011-06-27 09:55 pm (UTC)
espanolbot: (Default)
From: [personal profile] espanolbot
Rarrgh, change bad!

Date: 2011-06-27 08:54 pm (UTC)
stillanerd: (Default)
From: [personal profile] stillanerd
The first arc of [Justice League] takes place 5 years in the past and serves as a Year One story for the Justice League. In story, up until this point, there have been no 'super-heroes', just super powered individuals who have sometimes been viewed with suspicion. By banding together, the Justice League wants to show the world that they are deserving the moniker of super-hero.


This sounds an awful lot like DC took it's cues from the X-Men with this approach.

The first arc will detail Superman's public debut. At this point, Dan Didio went on a tangent to explain that DC wanted to let go of the past and move forward. Any changes in continuity would be addressed in-story as needed, but that they really didn't want to get bogged down so these reveals would be gradual and as they make sense in the story. There is a document in the DC offices that fleshes out exactly what has and hasn't happened in the New 52 Universe. As an example, the Death of Superman storyline has occurred.


And this sounds an awful lot like how Marvel was defending Spider-Man: One More Day.

Date: 2011-06-28 02:52 am (UTC)
terabient: Poorly drawn Noel Vermillion (Default)
From: [personal profile] terabient
So they're letting go of the past, except when they aren't?

GREAT IDEA

Date: 2011-06-27 09:06 pm (UTC)
rordulum: (Default)
From: [personal profile] rordulum
If Batman wasn't 'broken', then why have DC decided to take Dick Grayson out of the cowl, and dump him from every book he was appearing in?

I also don't count reducing Dick's appearances from what, 5 a month, to 1 as "little to no changes".

And how does Stephanie work better as Spoiler, exactly? I can't think of a single way that's true. Still, I can't wait for DC to get slated by people for giving Oracle her legs back, so she can be a 'proper hero' again.

JLA takes place in the past, and won't sync up with any other titles? Oh yeah, that's a great way of getting new readers up to speed with continuity, isn't it?

Date: 2011-06-28 12:16 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
On Dick--I always assumed that it was a temporary thing with Bruce back. Bruce had Dick stay on as Batman because Bruce was going to be travelling the world to set up Batman Incorporated and he needed someone he trusted to protect Gotham. With #10, Batman's probably going to be done setting up shop, and in Nightwing #1 we'll probably see Dick saying that with Bruce done setting up, he wants to be back as his own man.

As for Stephanie...probably because a lot of what made Steph great as Batgirl was that, in a lot of ways, she was a young Barbara Gordon with blonde hair.

And they explicitly say that the FIRST ARC of JL is in the past, telling the origin, and that the second arc is in the present.

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Date: 2011-06-27 09:18 pm (UTC)
zechs80: (Eye Twitch)
From: [personal profile] zechs80
<-----

Date: 2011-06-27 09:20 pm (UTC)
terabient: 'where's my motivation' (PFSC: Motivation)
From: [personal profile] terabient
I am so confused :(

Date: 2011-06-27 09:41 pm (UTC)
espanolbot: (Default)
From: [personal profile] espanolbot
They're trying to have their cake and eat it, ending up with a comicbook universe held together with spit and bits of string.

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Date: 2011-06-27 09:56 pm (UTC)
perletwo: she's limber (batgirl - steph archback)
From: [personal profile] perletwo
...yeah, having had a look or three at recent arcs on BatO, I can sure get behind Didio's opinions on "what works better." GAH.
thehefner: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thehefner
Where's the Two-Face panel from? Is that the one with the renegade general, or a different one?

Date: 2011-06-27 10:32 pm (UTC)
turtlefu: (Default)
From: [personal profile] turtlefu
"Dan Didio said she worked better as Spoiler"

Dan Didio is an idiot and wrong, but then again he has always been.

I LOVE how they say they are moving forward, while doing INCREDIBLY regressive things, like putting Babs back in the suit.

Another issue I want address:

While Gail may be the ONLY female creator in the new reboot, DC is actually screwing her over. They took her off Birds of Prey and told her NOTHING about the book she has worked so hard on for so long, and THEN they cancelled Secret Six, to be replaced by Suicide Squad, featuring King Shark and Deadshot and AGAIN didn't even bother telling her those characters were being used!
They are not treating her fairly.

Date: 2011-06-27 10:40 pm (UTC)
whitesycamore: (Default)
From: [personal profile] whitesycamore
Yes, a better policy might have been to continue on with the comics remaining basically as they were, only taking more care to make sure they were *actually good.*

They've also treated Brian Q Miller terribly unfairly, considering how well received his run on Batgirl was - he's not been approached to write any new projects for DC. At all.

I'm pretty bitter, since Secret Six and Batgirl were the only two titles I could really rely on to not suck.

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Date: 2011-06-27 10:33 pm (UTC)
whitesycamore: (Default)
From: [personal profile] whitesycamore
Teen Titans- All four Robins star or co-star in a book.

For a moment there I thought that meant that all the boy Robins would be having semi-regular adventures together in the same book. I was all XDDDDD

But then I realised what you actually meant.

Date: 2011-06-27 10:50 pm (UTC)
turtlefu: (Default)
From: [personal profile] turtlefu
Also, they CLEARLY want all the books to be just like their TV/film adaptations, but that is the exact OPPOSITE of how it should be!

Why do the stupid mainstream, the people who LIKE Smallville etc., get to decide how MY comics are! I understand that they want to draw in new readers, but how about making the TV shows based on the comics, thereby actually drawing in viewers to the comics.

Date: 2011-06-27 10:56 pm (UTC)
whitesycamore: (Default)
From: [personal profile] whitesycamore
Why do the stupid mainstream, the people who LIKE Smallville etc., get to decide how MY comics are!

I understand the sentiment... I guess... but if you're going to heap scorn on people for liking stupid things, you ought to appreciate that superhero comic readers live in one extremely brittle glass house. :/

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Date: 2011-06-27 11:28 pm (UTC)
retro_nouveau: The bat thing is just a phase (8)
From: [personal profile] retro_nouveau
Yes! One good thing to happen in a whole mess of bad things. Stephanie Brown is awesome no matter what she's wearing, but this is her own look that she stitched together with her own ideas and resources, with no bat symbols or bird colors to be found. Eggplant Enforcer eternally!

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Date: 2011-06-28 12:37 am (UTC)
stillanerd: (Default)
From: [personal profile] stillanerd
Apparently, Dan Didio never said he preferred Stephanie Brown as the Spoiler; furthermore, according to some in attendance, Stephanie Brown was never even mentioned.

Also, Gail Simone tweeted that, in response to the stuff about Batgirl (as reiterated on the DC Women Kicking Ass blog) stated on her twitter that "At least one of those facts is dead wrong" and "one thing is meant to be revealed in-story, instead of a soundbite on a gossip site."

Date: 2011-06-28 12:52 am (UTC)
newnumber6: (density)
From: [personal profile] newnumber6
Way to reach out to the new reader. Keep some of the universe the same as it's been the last 10-20 years. Completely change the rest of it. Now a new reader comes in and Superman's the first hero and only been active 5 years and nobody, not even established fans, have even a clue about what's happened in his history (apparently it never included marrying Lois), yet Batman's had 5 Robins, one's grown up, one's died and come back to life, Batman himself has died and come back, broken his back, given up being Batman twice, now there's an international organization of Batman operatives all over the world.

Nice shot in the arm, there. You've made it more impenetrable than ever.

A vision for your universe that you can't easily explain is one that's going to be a hard sell for new readers.

Date: 2011-06-28 02:14 am (UTC)
arbre_rieur: (Default)
From: [personal profile] arbre_rieur
The thing is, a person's only going to see that sort of big picture viewpoint after they've *already* become a fan. What you're describing are things big-time fans consider. Casual readers and new readers aren't going to be thinking about how perfectly the fictional universe's timeline meshes.

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Date: 2011-06-28 01:05 am (UTC)
rdfox: Joker asking Tim Drake, "'Sup?" from Paul Dini's "Slay Ride" (Default)
From: [personal profile] rdfox
"Dan Didio said she worked better as Spoiler."

Date: 2011-06-28 01:54 am (UTC)
pepperspray101: Attempting to give a damn, process failed, damn not given (Don't give a damn)
From: [personal profile] pepperspray101
*points up to her icon*

Date: 2011-06-28 02:16 am (UTC)
q99: (Default)
From: [personal profile] q99
-
Another change DC is making is that they won’t be ‘writing for the trade’ anymore. Writers have been told to write the story they want to write and not worry about the trade collecting. If they can tell a well-paced story in 4 issues, they’ve been told not to pad it to make it 6 issues. Editorial can worry about how it’s going to be collected.
-

That's one thing I like.


As for Steph.... eeeeeh, she was good as BG and it did well critically and reasonably sales-wise. I like her as the eggplant BG.

Date: 2011-06-28 02:24 am (UTC)
q99: (Default)
From: [personal profile] q99
I think one of the *big* problems of DC is they don't allow stuff to grow. They push something for a year or two, and if it's not immensely huge, it's disposable to them and gets undone/killed/etc.. Which then encourages people to not care about other new stuff.

Date: 2011-06-28 03:03 am (UTC)
big_daddy_d: (Default)
From: [personal profile] big_daddy_d
1. Since they are no longer writing for trades, I do still hope some books are collected in trades or hardcover because I prefer collecting them like that. I do think that some books don't need tons of issues to tell a story. Hell I always thought the 3 issue format of First Born and Broken Trinity were brilliant as they were big stories but pulled off in just 3 issues. Some stories need to be told in a lot more than 1 issue, and some not so much.

2. 5 years...*sigh*...I hate seeing that..it just..makes no sense..they will just be cramming shit in there if that's the case. There needs to be more than 5 years or else they will just have to retcon certain events and stories out of continuity period. Otherwise, setting themselves up for trouble.

3. Funny about the "If it ain't broke" thing....Stephanie as Batgirl..nothing broken about that. Stephanie became a better character, someone who Bruce clearly trusted with more responsibility, even before she took the cowl. A place was found for Cassandra Cain in her role as Blackbat. Barbara Gordon has been great as Oracle, and while I don't mind her walking again, I never wanted to see her as Batgirl again unless it was in a flashback, story that takes place in the past, or just for a single story purpose and said story called for it.

Now I'm not really upset about Stephanie as Spoiler again, except that..again...the backtracking. Is it necessary? Could she be just as great as she was as Batgirl? She needs her own series and as Spoiler, it feels like once again she's just another supporting character where as Batgirl, she was carrying her own fuckin series and it was fun to read!

So the question remains..where is Stephanie? What's her place in DCnU? Hell where will Cassandra be? What about Mia? Good god, no one's talked about her and I'm surprised no one on s_d didn't even notice a lack of mention of her. While on Green Arrow related subjects..what will also become of Connor Hawke? What about Miss Martian? Noticed she's missing from the Teen Titan lineup too.

4. Unncessessary shit that needs to be retconned out. Number 1 on my list personally..Cry for Justice. Sure, they gave Roy his arms back but I can deal with him lacking one arm as long as idk...Lian was brought back? In fact, everything that happened to Roy because of Cry for Justice was stupid and should've been reversed in my opinion. As Red Arrow he was growing, becoming a better hero and maturing. Lian should be back and he should be Red Arrow again and not just the damn druggie hero! So fine, he got his other arm back. He's still Arsenal, but...I want Lian back. Retcon that shit. Retcon Cry for Justice and treat that as nothing more than a horrible dream that NEVER happened.

Admittedly I will say this, on the Green Arrow side of things, keep The Queen, I think she's a great villain.

Also since they insist on keeping Identity Crisis in continuity..can they at least retcon Sue Dibny's rape?..Just..come up with other reasons for the mindwiping, hell they had reason enough with the whole body switching thing where the villains did the smartest villain thing ever..and took off the heroes' masks in front of a mirror! Reason enough for ya?

5. If they want an unmarried Superman, do it in Action Comics, which seems to take place in the past anyway, but still. If I pick up an issue of Superman: The Man of Tomorrow, Today, I want to see Clark Kent married to Lois Lane! DC, do not make the same mistake as Marvel and fuck up something that shouldn't be messed with less you want more of a shit storm than you already got.

6. No more events. At least not annually. Or if you gotta do big crossover books..just do it for fuckin fun! No tie-ins, no status quo changes. Just. Fun.

7. Characters I want to see shine, Cyborg, Mera, Aquaman, Stephanie, Roy Harper (in fact at a certain point in Outlaws, I hope he goes back to being Red Arrow and becoming a hero again), while at it find a good place for Starfire as well, Mia Dearden, Beast Boy (without him being annoying and twilight level obsessed/stalkerish with Raven or anyone), Rose Wilson, Jason Rausch (I actually don't like Ronnie much anymore..he came off as a insensitive jerkass to me post Blackest Night), Aqualad, Star Girl, Static Shock, Blue Beetle, Artemis.

8. Bring back the JSA dammit and keep them in continuity. If not the older members then at least keep the All-Star team around. Want to present Superman as the world's first hero, fine, but dammit idk how about the JSA being presented as forgotten heroes or something.

9. Do not fuck over the Marvels or forget them either..

P.S. This one isn't a big deal, but it involves ships.

1. Put Green Arrow/Black Canary back together.

2. Keep Superman/Wonder Woman as having dated in the past. Keep it at that and move on.

3. No more of this WW/Aquaman shit. Something about it is not right to me.

4. I would honestly like to see Batman/WW or Batman/Zatanna. Sorry Bruce/Selina but blame DC for making those two garner such interest.

5. Wouldn't hurt you to showcase more lesbian Amazons and to make Wonder Woman bi. Let's see some serious relationships with women. Personally I would like to see WW/Io..or WW/Artemis.

6. Stop having Hawkman keep every woman with Hawk in her name to himself.

Oh, ONE more thing....add Nightstar to continuity. With Kingdom Come children being added to continuity by the minute, would make sense for her to be among them.

Date: 2011-06-30 09:37 am (UTC)
eyz: (Default)
From: [personal profile] eyz
"1. Put Green Arrow/Black Canary back together."
YES to that!!

"2. Keep Superman/Wonder Woman as having dated in the past. Keep it at that and move on."
I hope so... I much prefer having Lois with Clark....

This part I can get behind

Date: 2011-06-28 06:39 am (UTC)
jazzypom: (i knit)
From: [personal profile] jazzypom
Another change DC is making is that they won’t be ‘writing for the trade’ anymore. Writers have been told to write the story they want to write and not worry about the trade collecting. If they can tell a well-paced story in 4 issues, they’ve been told not to pad it to make it 6 issues. Editorial can worry about how it’s going to be collected.

This part I can get behind. There's nothing worse than decompression story telling. Which is why I like the Young Avengers stuff by Heinberg- the story just zips along, but you don't lose the connection with the characters during the ride.

Date: 2011-06-28 12:53 pm (UTC)
blackruzsa: (Default)
From: [personal profile] blackruzsa
They're removing everything that had problems, huh?
I can think of a dozen different problems there are that WEREN'T in the comics they're removing even if I'm predominantly a Marvel girl.

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