Mod Post: Clarifications about Rule Changes, Moderation, and NoScans

[aeka]

Greetings Scans Daily,

We would like to first thank all of you for being patient with us while we took the time to look over all the feedback we received on our last post regarding rule modifications. I would also like to personally apologise to everyone for taking this long to make this post since life took a serious hard hit on my end as of late and hadn't really had the energy to make a post of this size. So again, thank you all for your patience.

Since we finally got around to discussing most of the issues at hand, the overall major areas of concern seem to be in the following areas:

1. Change to the first rule about posting
2. Moderation is too strict
3. SD and NSD are on two separate platforms

Since the contents of this post are quite lengthy, we've divided these posts into sections addressing each point individually.


1. Change to the first rule about posting

First and foremost, we want everyone to remember that Scans Daily's primary function has always been to post and discuss comic scans, while NoScans Daily was specifically created for comic related discussions without the scans. This was true back when Scans Daily was still an LJ community, this is true even now. In fact, one of the former mods from the LJ days even confirmed this. As such, one of the reasons for the change was to clarify how posts to the comm were to be done. Another reason was to make the rules on the info page consistent with those on the posting checklist. One of the issues that arose with the way the original first rule was worded was that it was too broad and open to interpretation. As a result we started seeing an increase of posts on topics that were either loosely related to comics, or were more appropriate material for NoScans Daily with a legality scan thrown in there as a concession to first rule. Not only does this shift the purpose of Scans Daily from its primary function by treating scans as secondary to the main topic, but it is also not within the raison d'etre of the community, thus effectively defeating the purpose of both comms.

Another reason for the change is the fact that we are bound by the limitations of DW's blogging software. Since tagging is one way we make it easier for users to find what they need at a more efficient manner, keeping the two comms separate with more focused functions makes it easier to keep tags under the set limit (particularly in SD's case). It also means less rules for users of both comms to follow, and it even makes moderation of both comms easier on the mod team.

Some of you expressed that you felt this was an issue the entire comm should've been consulted about first before implementing any changes. We would like to assert this was not a question of redefining the comm's purpose, but an issue of moderation that needed to be addressed. The mod team spent over a month discussing the rules and suggesting changes that would clarify posting rules and guidelines for users, stay true to the comm's purpose, as well as make the posting checklist consistent with the rules on the info page, and so that it is easier for users to follow. These were not changes that were done over night and were heavily discussed, agreed upon, and supported by the mod team before releasing the finalised versions.

2. Moderation is too strict

With regards to our moderation style, some of you expressed the concern that we are "too strict." We would like to remind everyone that both SD and NSD are feminist communities. This is explicitly stated on both comms' user infos, and it is even reiterated on the SD comm's sidebar. Given the nature and ethos of both comms, anti-oppression and anti-discriminatory behaviour is our policy. As such we tailor our rules of conduct and disciplinary action to protect the interests of more marginalised groups, and to effectively reduce the chances of an all out flamewar from taking place.

It has been suggested that we are too PC in our moderation that we thus "suck the fun out of free discussion." The reality is there are plenty of spaces on the web where people can have fun with their casual racism, sexism, misogyny, homophobia, etc, while discussing their favourite comics. There are, however, very few spaces on the web where more marginalised individuals can openly discuss issues that affect them personally as comic readers without being personally attacked and ridiculed by other (typically less aware) users. Neither SD nor NSD are spaces where things like casual racism are tolerated and we will always take the side of the person feeling threatened by another user's oppressive and/or discriminatory behaviour.

It is often erroneously believed by many that things like racism and misogyny have to be deliberate and/or intentional for them to count as such, but I can safely say (as psych major) that this is not true. Intent is only one aspect that maintains and influences the prevalence of systems like racism and misogyny. Socialisation, internalisation, and subsequently behaviour are three others. As a result, most people aren't even aware of when they behave in ways that are racist or misogynist, even if they themselves don't actively discriminate against people of other ethnicities or women. Therefore if you are ever issued a mod note telling you to cease a certain behaviour, it is because you are either being deliberately offensive, behaving in ways that are offensive, or are just being generally disruptive in the community. Depending on the severity of the infraction and/or repetition of infractions can lead to a warning, a suspension, or a banning all in that order. That is to say you will never get to one without going through all the previous ones first. While we're on the subject, we would like to further clarify that mod notes are NOT warnings, but are in fact just notes. Notes letting you know to either tone it down or modify your behaviour.

All that being said, we would like to similarly remind everyone that the mod team is always approachable at any time via PM or our email: scansdailymod[at]gmail[dot]com. If you have any problems, concerns, or questions about anything you wish to address, you are free to contact us directly. If you are ever offended by a particular post, another user's behaviour, or are feeling personally attacked, contact us. If you are unsure of how to make a post to the community or if your post counts as legal, contact us. If you ever feel that another member of the mod team is behaving in ways that offends you, contact one of us. We do not bite and we will be more than happy to discuss the things that bother you.

3. SD and NSD are on two separate platforms

With regards to SD and NSD being on two separate platforms, since this is an issue that directly affects the noscans_daily community, we are actually holding this discussion and poll over there.

The mod team has actually been thinking about moving that comm over to this platform for some time now and the reasons for the consideration are addressed in the modpost linked.

You are all welcome to join in the conversation there, and if you are able to, vote on the poll as well.

Comments

[thatnickguy]

I've rarely run into troubles with this community. The one time I did, I honestly still have an issue with it. I said something like "Yeah bitches!" or something like that. It wasn't meant to be derogative in any sort whatsoever and yet it was still deleted. Not a very big deal, but in the context of how I was using it, I didn't see the need for it to be moderated.

[glprime]

Well, there's about the only place where we've encountered "too PC." And as the mods are saying, one person's "aw yeah!" is another person's "dirty comment!" So it's not as if we can say, "but that stuff's alright, right?"

(though every now and again you do just want to say that; pwning does call for it, certainly?)

[cleome45]

Aren't there other phrases that work just as well without using the word "bitches," though?

[glprime]

On-topic: "yeah, noobs!" if I were gaming. But it's still a cry of domination, so not really respectable in spirit anyways.

Sidebar: The word in that context (that saying even got so ingrained in pop culture, and been used by so many people (including prominent women if some of those examples are to be believed), the gender derogative and context-sensitive appellation of "dominated inferior" have split off pretty cleanly, not to mention those that have made efforts to "take back" the slur into positive appellation (such as Tina Fey's infamous "Bitches Get Shit Done" quote). I'd argue it is literally becoming a subjective meaning on the intent of the word used person-to-person. But that's neither here nor there in this environ.

[werehawk]

That's one thing I like about scans_daily and the moderation (pun intended), learning a little about the roots of words and how our society has basically fucked with our minds to ingrain slurs as common language. To me it seems to be about learning not to be a part of the problem (something I think about as a parent). I have no problem with foul language and vitriol as long as it is not oppressive.

I wish I remembered the word, but there was a time that a word (not mine) got fridged by mods and it was a learning moment for me as I did understand where it came from before. And I really appreciate that - wish I remember what word though.

[werehawk]

Ah, hysterical. That was it. I had not understood its origins before s_d and now I know, which is half the battle, right?

[salinea]

quite ^_^

Agreed

[kenwyn89]

I remember that, and I knew the origin in a back-of-my-mind way (being a ancient history student) but I guess I hadn't realised the connotations were still very much relevant in modern usage. I've been lurking on Scans-Daily for years now and I've always appreciated the way it handles issues.

[cleome45]

"...I have no problem with foul language and vitriol as long as it is not oppressive..."

Yeah.

I admit it: I'm a little perplexed when people complain about having to weigh how our words come across before we hit "post." Isn't that just how life in general works for just about everyone? I'm not saying it's always easy, or it's never aggravating to try and do this, but still... :/

[aeka]

The fact that "bitches" is a derogatory and misogynistic term aimed exclusively at women means that it will always reinforce misogyny regardless of its use in context. There are also better ways of expressing yourself and getting the same point across that doesn't resort to using misogynistic language in the process.

[auggie18]

So, recently there was a discussion in which somebody asked a mod if they could use the b-word in a positive manner, for example: "head bitch in charge." The mod in question said it was okay in that context, but it seems like you're saying it isn't okay in any context.

The conversation in question took place here:

http://scans-daily.dreamwidth.org/3744904.html

[aeka]

In the case of "head bitch in charge" that's more of a case of someone (usually a woman) reclaiming a word that is used to oppress them and using it to empower themselves. So I can see why it would be acceptable in that case. "Yeah bitches" is not a case of reclaiming the word to empower one's self, that is a case of using it casually, which unfortunately is neither empowering towards the affected group, nor is it being used positively.

[auggie18]

...I'm just gonna keep not using it all.

[big_daddy_d]

Hmm I gotta ask then because it's interesting that you say that a woman using the b-word is a case of reclaiming. I happen to be a black man so if I just all of a sudden started using the n-word left and right (which I'll own up to having said it plenty in real life in the neighborhood I lived in and the type of friends I've hung out with growing up. I decided to give it up, but old habits) or say something like "I'm the head n-word in charge" that would be ok and not make people uncomfortable?

[salinea]

Our rule isn't that any women can use "bitch" because it's reclaiming when they do it; it's that it's okay to use "bitch" if it's used in an obviously positive fashion.

In general, it's your prerogative to use the n-word in a reclaiming fashion as a Black man, however on the internet it's not particularly obvious what any given person's skin color is; and therefore a bit harder to convey the meaning that it is used in reclaiming fashion rather than as a slur. (Well, the main way to do so I can think of would be to use the... I'm not sure what's the proper linguistic word is for it... when it's written as "nigga". I think that does tend to convey reclamation. Is this what you're asking about?) Add to that the fact that the n-word is a word with a much, much, much more negative connotation than "bitch" when used as a slur (for the closest equivalent on the sexism spectrum, we're not saying that we're okay with people using "cunt" as they want as long as they say it's in order to reclaim it); then no, I don't think it would work very well with the community's rules as they stand.

Does that sound reasonable to you?

[greenmask]

TBH, the mod team was split on s_d use of reclaimed "bitch/es" (full disclosure: I was against).

I have no answer to your question. If you gave no "I am a black man" disclaimer with it we would probably have to note or warn you because the n-word is so very no when used 'without license' and we don't want members to think that strangers can use the n-word about them if they don't want it. But that's.. hardly perfect, is it?

See, I don't like reclaimed-bitches used here, because I don't like reclaimed-bitch at all - I don't see the strength in it and it makes me feel mildly disrespected. But I am not the empress - reclaiming "bitch" doesn't belong only to me. If you feel like reclaiming the n-word is something you care enough about, I guess we can see what happens. It's all experiments.

[greenmask]

Or what Sal said, that too.

[salinea]

I like your take!

[whitesycamore]

But I am not the empress

I AM DISILLUSIONED. D:

[greenmask]

What's one step down from empress?? I'm that, I'm that!

[thatnickguy]

I guess that's my point: in the context that I mean it, it's not meant to be misogynistic at all. It's like saying "yeah, everybody!" or something like that. Believe me when I say I'm about the least misogynistic person and when I use a term like that, it's not meant to be even taken seriously.

Anyway, it's a moot point because I haven't used the term once since I was modded over it.

[greenmask]

We really do appreciate your not using it since you were asked not to.