Tiny Smidge of Lil Gotham
Oct. 31st, 2012 05:46 pm![[personal profile]](http://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
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scans_daily The last bastion of the Old DCU, complete with certain folk who have vanished from the DCU.
Steph, Klarion and Cass (dressed as Jason for some reason) out trick or treating! :D
http://dcwomenkickingass.tumblr.com/pos
Steph, Klarion and Cass (dressed as Jason for some reason) out trick or treating! :D
http://dcwomenkickingass.tumblr.com/pos
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Date: 2012-10-31 06:08 pm (UTC)A part of me is actually scared that this does big business and gets on Didio's radar and he shuts it down (or at least orders certain characters - I think we all know which ones - not to appear). I guess as long as this seems like a kiddie comic to the people who run it's OK - The Johnny DC Shazam series was very good and fun even while the Marvel Family was being ruined in the DCU and Tiny Titans seem to do whatever they wanted and had both Cass and Steph and even Kid Devil (who Didio once said would stay dead as long as he was at DC).
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Date: 2012-10-31 06:55 pm (UTC)The man may make decisions that I don't agree with (and many of them), but he really does seem to love the medium of comics and is an enthusiastic spokesperson for the company he runs.
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Date: 2012-10-31 09:16 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-10-31 09:35 pm (UTC)They are trying like crazy to impress the profile of the new DCU, and that means keeping their character array as focussed as possible.
Given it's history, Smallville is a potential gateway from TV viewers to become comic readers, this is important to DC.
Which female is most associated with Batman in the public consciousness? Sadly perhaps, NOT Stephanie Brown, but Barbara Gordon.
So if Batman is going to have a female partner, Babs is the logical choice, if you don't want to fragment and dilute the characters you are focussing on. If there had been time to change the art, I can imagine she would have been Batgirl rather than Nightwing.
Do I think it WORKS in this case? Not really, but I can see the logic.
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Date: 2012-11-01 11:27 am (UTC)As for there not being time to change the art, I have to call BS on that one; Jim Lee was able to do a quick turnaround on Hush when editorial couldn't make their minds up on whether Selina was going to learn Bruce's identity. He basically photoshopped a new head in there, and it was seamless. I see no reason to believe that if they wanted to, they couldn't have 'shopped in Batgirl gear onto Barbara. It's just lazy and even if it isn't Didio's intention, it just comes across as spiteful.
To say nothing of the fact that they didn't even get Miller to change his dialogue; There was nothing in there that even suggested Barbara.
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:13 pm (UTC)http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/11/0
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:20 pm (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2012-11-01 10:55 pm (UTC)http://yurblecryingalonewithcomicbo
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:42 am (UTC)It's like DC is going out of their way to shit all over the joy. We can't even get a cute little shoutout to Steph without some asshole sticking their head in to remind us, "Yeah, but that's not really Stephanie Brown."
It just... it infuriates me, because Li'l Gotham was so sweet and adorable and I really enjoyed it when I read it. And seeing Steph and Klarion marching arm-in-arm in amongst all the trick-or-treaters, that made me smile. It didn't matter to me whether they were actually Steph and Klarion, enjoying the fact that they could walk down the street in costume without attracting any strange glances, or whether they were just a pair of kids dressing up as their favourite heroes. I just liked seeing a shout-out to one of my favourite characters, and I enjoyed the little callback to Steph and Klarion's Valentine's Day hijinks in BQM's Batgirl. It made me happy. And then they had to go and sour it.
That little cameo wasn't doing anybody any harm. And still, DC just has to come in and slap on a shoddy recolour job, because apparently Stephanie Brown isn't allowed to appear in any comic ever.
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Date: 2012-11-01 04:19 am (UTC)I swear, if YJ "Before the Dawn" is re-edited before it airs in January...
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Date: 2012-11-01 04:57 am (UTC)Because, from a marketing standpoint--okay, I'll bite. They want to focus their energy on Babs!Batgirl. I don't agree with it (I liked Barbara as Oracle), but that's the direction they're taking, so fine. But I'm not seeing any monetary benefit that comes from what appears to be (whether or not it is in actuality) a conscious attempt to alienate a portion of their fan base. If it's true that they recolored Steph's hair just to remove the easter egg shout-out to Steph fans (and, from what little I know about the situation, that's what it looks like) then someone explain to me what is the point if not to alienate said fans? Because there's certainly no risk that readers are going to see that and go "Wait! But Barbara Gordon...?"
It just brings to mind what I read as Didio's justification for the absence of Stephanie, Cass, Wally, and Donna. Without going back and rereading it, I believe his justification for not bringing in Wally is that, if they did, then people would be demanding to know when he'd become the Flash. That excuse falls flat, to me; isn't that what we're already demanding? But short of that, it wouldn't take much to get us at least somewhat on-board. I have refused to buy any Flash comics until Wally shows up (and I've since stopped buying most new DC titles, save Young Justice, and I did buy this issue of Li'l Gotham). Notice I didn't say I refuse to buy any issues *until Wally becomes Flash*, I said until his existence is acknowledged, and in some way (however peripheral) worked into the DC Universe.
Because all I want is some confirmation that Wally exists in this new universe. At this point I don't care if he shows up and has never been the Flash, never been Kid Flash, never been a superhero of any sort. Let me amend that--I do care, but I will be elated just to see the character in some way, shape, or form. And as much as I do not like the direction DC is taking, I'll probably buy every issue where he shows up, no matter how briefly. Because Wally is "that character" to me, the one I've grown irrationally attached to, the one who, every time I see his Young Justice action figure in the discount bin, I have to fight the urge to buy it, even though I already have one.
I think a lot of us have a character like that. And for those of us who happen to be unlucky enough to have attached ourselves to Wally, Cass, Steph, or Donna, we'd be happy to see these characters in any form, and we'd throw our money at any comic that included them. And they can 100% be folded into this universe, even if it takes throwing out their entire spandexed history.
Yes, there will be those who won't be happy until or unless Stephanie took over as Batgirl again, which is understandable. I certainly won't be 100% satisfied until Wally is the Flash again. But if he existed at all, I'd probably by 60-80% satisfied, and that's more than enough to get my hard-earned dollars. And I don't think I'm the only one. If DC is looking to increase their sales, I know a way they could do it with only minimal effort. Just sayin'.
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Date: 2012-11-01 11:39 am (UTC)Pretty much this. I would love it if Steph was Batgirl again, but I'm not so stupid as to think it'll actually happen in the next ten years, probably even more, but.. Just some acknowledgement would be nice. Didio comes out with this nonsense about how he wants to 'make sure each character's story matters' and that they're given a great introduction, but it's absolute nonsense; We have the four male Robins and yet I've not seen one story that really justifies needing all of them. We have people like Rob Liefeld fucking up what could be a fantastic character like Lobo. We have characters like Bane being used with little or no fanfare, when realistically, Bane being one of the lead rogues in a book should have made the comic one of the biggest of the summer, given his big screen appearance.
It's a clusterfuck, and I have no reason to not look at Dan Didio as complete and utter liar. But as you say, it's not that I want Steph in the Batgirl role again. It would just be nice to have her around - and even Cass; I don't have as much attachment to Cass as I do Steph, but Cass' book was one of the first I started reading when getting into comics properly, so I understand the want for her to be around. But we can't have even that.
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:56 pm (UTC)I happen to like all four Robins, and I wouldn't wish any of them out of existence, but it doesn't make sense, and clearly they didn't plan out all the Robins' history to make them "meaningful" (as we've seen with Tim). I'm sure their argument would be something along the lines of Batman being a huge seller and not wanting to mess with it, and YET, the claim the entire time was to want new readers. Batman, being one of the 2-3 best known superheroes, likely acts as a gateway to the DC comics universe for many would-be readers. By that reasoning, it should have been the first to have its continuity streamlined and simplified.
But instead I'm supposed to believe that in five years, Batman's had four Robins (but only one Batgirl, of course), died, Dick's picked up the mantle, then returned to life? The mind boggles.
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Date: 2012-11-01 05:38 pm (UTC)So.. Yeah. The mind boggles. We're expected to believe Batman took in four kids in just about five years, but more than one girl? EW NO GET THOSE GROSS CASS AND STEPH COOTIES AWAY!!!
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Date: 2012-11-01 03:26 pm (UTC)If they had gotten rid of Todd and Drake (and said Damien took over from Dick as Robin) from continuity, I could buy them getting rid of Cass and Steph but otherwise? No.
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Date: 2012-11-01 05:28 pm (UTC)I also don't entirely understand the need to cram everything into five years, and to make every hero under the age of about twenty five, but that might just be my personal feelings coming into play, given at twenty six, I've already started encountering some weirdly ageist stuff when it comes to job interviews and applications.
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Date: 2012-11-01 05:41 pm (UTC)And ageism is the worst thing about this reboot. No doubt. There have been isolated issues on how women have been treated in some books but that has nothing to the overall ageism (made largely by middle-aged editors) which tells us that no one can be over 35, everybody should have perfect bodies (i.e. the Amanda Waller effect) and look like models and even in an alternate Earth characters like Jay Garrick and Alan Scott have to be made 20-something (while their children are retconned away). It's insulting.
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Date: 2012-11-01 06:37 pm (UTC)It just reminds me of when I was younger, my range of what I saw as "interesting" characters was pretty much limited to those in their teens and early twenties. Those were the characters I took up when I role-played in internet chat rooms, and all the original characters I created were inevitably in that same age range.
Now I see how limited that point of view was. That some seem to think that the "Big Three" have to be in their twenties to be relevant or interesting just blows my mind. Doubly so because the people making these decisions are not 15-16-year-olds like I am; instead, they're largely in their 30s, 40s, and so on themselves.
And this idea, that Superman must be the first hero and must still be in the twenties has seriously damaged what I see as one of the major strengths about DC: its depth and sense of history. We know that progress in mainstream comics is limited or non-existent, most major changes get undone, but with DC there was at least the illusion of the passage of time, from the JSA to the JLA, multiple incarnations of Teen Titans, sidekicks growing up to become their own heroes (Dick) or take up legacy mantles (Wally). Yes it was confusing, but as a relatively recent DC comics reader (only started 5 years ago or so), I can say that it's entirely possible to get the general idea, and learn as you go.
For the past..ten(ish) years, DC has slowly walked back all that progress, bringing back Hal and Barry and so on. And then, with the reboot, they obliterated large swaths of the universe's history, kicked the JSA out of mainstream continuity, and shortened the timeline so that the age range of characters we're supposed to care about stops at 30. It's a shame, it really is.
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Date: 2012-11-01 08:49 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-11-01 11:31 am (UTC)It still strikes me as really fishy, of course, that it was changed at the last minute, but I still buy that argument more than the complete and utter bullshit that occurred with Smallville.
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Date: 2012-11-01 12:52 pm (UTC)I don't know. It just flat-out doesn't make sense to me. There's no logical reason for changing the colouring, and in the context of all the other crap DC's pulled on Steph, I can't help but feel this is pretty suss.
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Date: 2012-11-01 01:28 pm (UTC)At this point, Didio's the guy who cried wolf, to me.
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:12 pm (UTC)http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/11/0
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Date: 2012-11-01 02:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-11-01 03:58 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-11-01 05:20 pm (UTC)That said, I absolutely predicted this too, the second DC put out the announcement on their blog. My comment under my actual name, via facebook, has about forty or fifty likes and jokes about how Didio would spot her and order the whole series cancelled.
After this? I totally have a queasy feeling in my gut.
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Date: 2012-11-02 01:06 am (UTC)no subject
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