Date: 2017-02-03 01:16 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
-"I'm learning how to fly telepathically from a test pilot"-
Aside from the clunky dialogue, and the dubious ethics of reading someone's mind without permission...
Shouldn't Jean know how to fly a jet by this point in her career?
Even if the X-Men haven't been using jets for a good couple decades in-universe, she scanned Dr. Corbeau's mind way back when.
She should know how to fly a jet...

As far as the Dramatic Reveal... it's not too bad. It was neatly foreshadowed, mildly surprising...
It's just everything that comes after it that's horrible.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:55 am (UTC)
lamashtar: "Wolverine does not appear in this issue" (Wolverine not appearing in this issue)
From: [personal profile] lamashtar
There are arguments that telepathic learning, like speed learning, doesn't last. Kind of like cramming for a test.

Main problem with the reveal was that Xorn was more interesting than evil Maggie. I'm puzzled how 'star for a brain' describes Magneto though..

Date: 2017-02-04 12:41 am (UTC)
zylly: (Ralph Unpossible)
From: [personal profile] zylly
I agree. I got out before this reveal, but the Xorn solo issue from early on really made me like the character.

Date: 2017-02-03 02:37 am (UTC)
deathcrist2000: (Default)
From: [personal profile] deathcrist2000
"A man in an iron prison. A star for a brain? I kept thinking it was too obvious, but still you missed it."

I'm still not sure if I get the reference. Is this a previous continuity reference or am I missing something obvious?

Date: 2017-02-03 03:15 am (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
X-MEN ANNUAL 2001, where "Xorn" first appeared.

Date: 2017-02-03 03:19 am (UTC)
deathcrist2000: (Default)
From: [personal profile] deathcrist2000
Yes, but how is the quote supposed to hint at Xorn being Magneto?

Date: 2017-02-03 03:43 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
Well, a star for a brain is probably meant to be utterly implausible.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daningram.insanejournal.com
Given that this is comics...how so? Weirder things have happened.

Also, wouldn't the X-Men have run some damn tests?

Date: 2017-02-03 07:04 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
Note the use the words "probably" and "meant".

Date: 2017-02-05 04:59 am (UTC)
liliaeth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] liliaeth
Not really when you're living in a world were characters like Chamber exist.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:35 am (UTC)
coldfury: (Default)
From: [personal profile] coldfury
Holocaust reference maybe?

Date: 2017-02-03 07:56 am (UTC)
lamashtar: Snake says, "What?" (What?)
From: [personal profile] lamashtar
The Holocaust references a star?

Date: 2017-02-03 08:33 am (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Star of David - but it's still a dubious link.

Date: 2017-02-06 11:27 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
That's what I was thinking, with Magneto having a Star of David on the brain.

Date: 2017-02-03 08:20 am (UTC)
sadoeuphemist: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sadoeuphemist
Iron and stars are both magnetic?

Date: 2017-02-03 05:23 am (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
The set-up and concept of Magneto as Xorn was really neat. Too bad Morrison had to botch it with what came after.
Edited Date: 2017-02-03 05:23 am (UTC)

Date: 2017-02-03 06:29 am (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
Morrison tends to write "evil is fun" bad guys.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:26 am (UTC)
byc: (Default)
From: [personal profile] byc
Somebody remind me...

So this was Xorneto. This Magneto was supposed to be a clone right? Because Wolverine decapitated him immediately once he got back. Real Magneto was on Genosha without powers right?

Date: 2017-02-03 07:58 am (UTC)
lamashtar: My crap writing senses are burning! (crapwriting)
From: [personal profile] lamashtar
Without knowing the labyrinth of the plot, I'm going to guess that someday we will discover that it WAS Xorn and he was faking being Magneto. For Reasons.

Date: 2017-02-03 08:34 am (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Already did. Just after "House of M", Xorn's consciousness took over the giant energy ball left over from so many depowered mutants and repowered Magneto, and somewhere in that mess it was exposited that in this story, Xorn had used his powers to alter himself into thinking and looking like he was the real Magneto because of hero worship.

Date: 2017-02-03 06:51 pm (UTC)
byc: (Default)
From: [personal profile] byc
So Xorneto actually IS Xorn pretending/thinking he was Magneto.

Meanwhile Magneto is on Earth in Genosha, and Whedon started using him in Astonisting a few months/weeks later right?

That's actually not terrible writing.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:00 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
Claremont brought him back actually. There was a whole bit where Erik was outraged people thought him capable of what Xorn did.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:28 pm (UTC)
byc: (Default)
From: [personal profile] byc
Yeah I remember reading somewhere Magneto was indignant. BS, you definitely did shit like that before.

Magneto hasn't been a real heel in almost 20 years now.

Date: 2017-02-03 07:36 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
When did he do anything comparable to marching people onto crematoriums?

Date: 2017-02-03 09:53 pm (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Still a better idea for Magneto than "Joseph".

Date: 2017-02-03 08:19 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
To my mind, this is the one story Marvel put out that was worse than Avengers Annual #10. Which is a tall order, but it just hits more bad notes.

Also, I suspect it was a spur of the moment thing. Xorn had no way of hiding his scent from Wolverine and Beast, and wasn't he asked to join once before, in China ?

Date: 2017-02-03 03:51 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] remial
what was the story in Avengers Annual 10?

Date: 2017-02-03 04:03 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
The one where Carol Danvers is mindcontrolled, impregnated, and has to give birth to the man who impregnated her.

Date: 2017-02-03 04:22 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
And the story treats this as a happy ending for Carol, with all the Avengers blissfully unconcerned about what's happening.

Date: 2017-02-03 09:58 pm (UTC)
dc2houseofmystery: (Default)
From: [personal profile] dc2houseofmystery
Avengers Annual 10 was the aftermath to that story, with Carol coming back from Limbo and nearly immediately being attacked by a still-evilRogue. It's absolutely harrowing.

Date: 2017-02-03 08:37 am (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
I think it's important to realize that, while writing this story, Morrison was going through a deeply depressive state with numerous deaths in his family. Not that it excuses any dip in quality (no more than Jeph Loeb's tragic loss of his son excuses "Ultimatum"), but it does explain why it gets so excessive - and also why you have Xavier, who most physically resembles Morrison, being disabled, humiliated and forced to watch his dream being destroyed.
Edited Date: 2017-02-03 08:37 am (UTC)

Date: 2017-02-04 09:00 am (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
That does maybe explain things a little, but he's gone on to do similar 'never mind the grey, they're eeeeevillll' stuff with other established villains later on, so.. I'm not sure I fully buy it. In both instances - him and Loeb - you'd have thought that an editor might have taken them aside and said 'the fuck guys?', but then.. The 00's seems to have been the age of the 'superstar writer' at Marvel, to me, where a lot of stuff seemed to get put out, no questions asked.

Date: 2017-02-03 11:56 am (UTC)
angelophile: (Death's Head surprised)
From: [personal profile] angelophile
It's a hell of a reveal and the hints and clues laid all the way through the run were impressive in retrospect. But while I admire the craft, it still disappointed me, because I loved Xorn as a character and his interactions with the kids were amazing. The idea he was all an invention...

But it's after this that it all fell apart. Everything building up to this big shock reveal, but once it was out the way, Morrison clearly had no idea what to do with Magneto or any understanding of his motivations or character, which had already been mangled a year or two earlier by Scott Lobdell.

Date: 2017-02-03 12:54 pm (UTC)
sneakylookingsort: A picture of Cassandra Cain looking badass (Default)
From: [personal profile] sneakylookingsort
Urgh, always felt this was the worst arc in the whole New X-Men run. Five issues of Magneto rambling about how humans deserve to die and couple of important characters end up dead but you don't really care because you are just happy the story is over.
Edited Date: 2017-02-03 12:58 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-02-03 03:04 pm (UTC)
thanekos: Yoshikage Kira as Kosaku Kawajiri, after the second arrow. (Default)
From: [personal profile] thanekos
Iron. Star.

Lodestar!

Polaris!

Wait.

Date: 2017-02-03 04:07 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
Holy irrational deduction, Batman!

Date: 2017-02-03 04:09 pm (UTC)
every_spiegel: (max)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
Planet X was and still remains a story that impressed me deeply (and even hurt a bit).

Date: 2017-02-03 05:26 pm (UTC)
indy2012: (Default)
From: [personal profile] indy2012
I love this story. Almost the entire run, really, with Whedon's Astonishing being a nice follow-up.

Morrison's New X-Men was my first foray into Marvel, and one of the books that my friends and I in Junior High would trade back and forth to each other and then discuss. Even reading in adulthood I get goosebumps sometimes at how well it holds up. The team dynamic. Emma Frost at her best and brightest. The soap melodrama that X-Men is so well known for still being present, yet more adult.

And gotta love Phil Jimenez. There are never 2 characters that he illustrates who have the same facial features.

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