Date: 2017-06-21 04:04 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] beardedjellybean
I really just want two things to happen before the series does end.

(1) Don't humanise Anissa. Give her a "I accept I was a bad person and I give my life for the greater good!" death, but please just don't let her get away without a comeuppance for the whole rape thing.

(2) Rex has been a villain sue for a while now, before it all ends please just let SOMEONE punch his head off.
Edited Date: 2017-06-21 04:06 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-06-21 05:33 pm (UTC)
goattoucher: (Shield)
From: [personal profile] goattoucher
I have -very- mixed feelings about this.

What Nolan is explaining here is that physical Darwinism was an important part of their culture. If you were weak, they killed you. If they wanted you sexually and you could not stop them, they took you (though they try to sterilize that last part by implying that Viltrumite sex is purely for procreation and producing strong children).

I'm not saying that culturally normalized rape and murder is okay. It's not. Look at cultures where female genital mutilation and honor killings are accepted practices: That's fucked up.

But here we have Anissa as the last Viltrumite female, coming from a cultural tradition where rape was normal and accepted. She rapes Mark and then settles into life on Earth. There, steeped in Earth culture, she and the other Viltrumites develop empathy, and begin to appreciate the sanctity of life, the freedom of choice and other Earth cultural traditions, and eventually takes them as her own.

Is she irredeemable? I don't know. As revolted I am by the rapes she committed, this character arc (only achievable in science fiction, as there are no modern Earth cultures where rape and murder are tolerated), presents a philosophical conundrum.
Edited Date: 2017-06-21 05:33 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-06-21 09:18 pm (UTC)
shadowpsykie: Information (Default)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
ummm reparative rape ARE acceptable in some cultures...


I do agree with what you said though... that Anissa was a coming from a culture where this is what you did in order to produce the strongest offspring and ensure your survival... it wasn't until "well.. this ISN'T how everyone lives.... "

Date: 2017-06-22 02:56 am (UTC)
goattoucher: (ShockedMags)
From: [personal profile] goattoucher
"Reparative Rape"?

Reparative rape... okay :researches: "Corrective Rape" Okay, let's see...

:reads:

:frowns:

The world is a horrible place.

Date: 2017-06-22 04:12 am (UTC)
shadowpsykie: Information (Default)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
Yeah.... sorry about that... to be fair, it's seen by many to be barbaric and not often practiced.... in the public...

I'm sorry if I'm being stupid, but...

Date: 2017-06-22 07:35 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] deh_tommy
"Don't humanise Anissa. Give her a ""I accept I was a bad person and I give my life for the greater good!"" death, but please just don't let her get away without a comeuppance for the whole rape thing."

What do you mean by this, exactly?

Re: I'm sorry if I'm being stupid, but...

Date: 2017-06-22 07:59 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] beardedjellybean
Maybe it just comes down to me rather disliking her as a character. Anissa was rather arrogantly annoying to start with and became rather loathsome after she rapes Mark.

I understand the whole Viltrumite cultural "only the strong" thing plays a factor, but I don't really want it to just be brushed off as that and Anissa be left unheeded to play happy families (her partner and kids are really nice, she is just so unlikable).

Maybe it's just me disliking it since when I was a kid where a character does a horrible act and the redemption arc plays it of as "they're totally good now and are an absolute hero, no matter all the brutal mass murder and such and we will no longer even mention those actions!" I always feel like they should make a serious effort to answer for their crimes and atone, where Anissa kinda just is allowed to live peacefully with her family.

I was the same when Nolan killed thousands in his initial fight with Mark, I get that his family would be capable of looking past it but the whole mass murderer thing got gradually pushed aside and he mostly just got banished to the moon.

Re: I'm sorry if I'm being stupid, but...

Date: 2017-06-22 07:46 pm (UTC)
shadowpsykie: Information (Default)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
I feel like... we should be able to see her journey and her change... if they want us to see her as humanized.... having a family and then an off comment about how she has changed hasn't SHOWN us HOW she's changed... it's as much for our sake as the character's that stuff like that is shown.... there is a reason it's called a redemption ARC.... we SHOULD see it.

Spike went through one in buffy. he had no soul, but he willingly sought out a soul knowing what it would do to him, and then willingly stood away from buffy because he KNEW what he did to her. it wasn't until buffy realizes he actually HAS changed that she even lets him near her. (the comics deal with more of that after math..)

speaking of.... why hasn't anyone posted anything here from the comics in a while?

Re: I'm sorry if I'm being stupid, but...

Date: 2017-06-22 12:29 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
They mean a character who raped someone shouldn't get away with it.

Re: I'm sorry if I'm being stupid, but...

Date: 2017-06-22 02:38 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] deh_tommy
That makes sense. Thank uou both for ypur clarification!

Date: 2017-06-23 01:27 am (UTC)
tigerkaya: (Default)
From: [personal profile] tigerkaya
Agreed I hope she's killed off for that rape stunt she pulled.

Date: 2017-06-21 04:18 pm (UTC)
coldfury: (Default)
From: [personal profile] coldfury
Wait, she named the kid after him?

Oh god, I think I missed that earlier.

Date: 2017-06-21 10:04 pm (UTC)
reveen: (Default)
From: [personal profile] reveen
I mean, this seemingly easy redemption comes in the same comic where the heroes slaughter their way through thousands of disposable suicidal child soldiers. So to me this comes off as kinda twisted. Redemption for this one rapist, no redemption to these hundreds of kids we had to kill because they didn't know any better.

I mean, this is Kirkman so I'd assume it being twisted is part of the point.

Date: 2017-06-21 11:15 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] onsokumaru
Also didn't those Viltrumites murder several innocent people? Maybe even commited genocide?
Heck, Omniman murder the Not Justice League and yet he is allowed to have a loving family.

Date: 2017-06-22 07:31 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] deh_tommy
Everyone's capable of change, for better or worse.

Date: 2017-06-22 12:32 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
Would you feel the same if it was Dr. Light or the Purple Man?

Date: 2017-06-22 01:23 pm (UTC)
goattoucher: (Cyke)
From: [personal profile] goattoucher
Those two were raised in a culture where rape is considered a heinous crime, but they do it anyway because they are psychopaths whose pathology has been exacerbated by power (especially Purple Man).

In Viltrumite culture, Anissa' actions are not atypical, because Viltrumite culture is terrible. Terrible as it was, it was all she knew. Now that she has immersed herself in human culture, her values have changed (frankly, the notion that these centuries old Viltrumites collectively and ubiquitously turned over new leaves after a couple-three years on Earth is a stretch).

I doubt that she is going to get a pass, nor should she. If Kirkman's prior work is any indication, she will be apologetic, but that won't miraculously heal all wounds.

Date: 2017-06-22 12:31 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
This just reminds me of Zelena on Once Upon a Time where she killed a guy's wife, pretended to be said wife and then raped the guy so she could pregnant. Then the guy was unceremoniously killed off and the rest of her arc was about her being a doting mother to the baby conceived via her raping someone. I mean I'll give credit to Kirkman for not ignoring that Anissa raped Mark and the icky implications of everything but still leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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