superboyprime: (Default)
[personal profile] superboyprime posting in [community profile] scans_daily


'I've never ever looked at the sales on the books. Never. It's never been an issue. What Ross and Joe achieved on "Glory" was similar to what Brandon has achieved on "Prophet" in that they have crafted an all-new way that people see the character. Their achievement on "Glory" is such a personal reflection of their unique creative styles that I can't just slot a creative team in behind them, and say, "Follow this..." I would have to see a take or a creative vision equal to what they produced in order to continue the book at this point.'

- Rob Liefeld, explaining why the book's ending (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=43459)














Date: 2013-05-01 08:33 am (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
'Rob Liefeld', 'good decisions', and 'massive respect' are something I'm kind-of alarmed to fit together in the same sentence. I.. Wow. Okay. He's still awful as an artist, IMO, but this almost entirely makes up for his ranting at DC and Marvel over various things a few months back, because.. Well, he clearly has a good understanding of 'artistic merit' - Better than most at DC at the minute, I'd wager.

Date: 2013-05-01 02:39 pm (UTC)
filthysize: (Default)
From: [personal profile] filthysize
It's hard to even blame him for the DC rant. Liefeld turned out to be 100% correct about DC editorial not knowing what the fuck they're doing. I'm a little sad that when he quit to take a stand, fans made fun of him, but when several other beloved creators quickly followed Liefeld's footsteps, those same fans starting punting DC.

Yeah, Liefeld's a shitty artist and an even worse writer, but that didn't make his claims any less legitimate.

Date: 2013-05-01 02:48 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
Well, yes and no. He has been vindicated in terms of DC not knowing what the Hell they're doing and in terms of alienating their creators, but I lost a lot of respect for him when, rather than just slam editorial, he started to slam other artists at the company. Case in point, his argument against the now sadly-passed Scott Clark, who Liefeld mouthed off about for his work on Grifter. And then Liefeld went on to display the bubble-headed ego that usually leads people to dislike him by saying that Marvel had made a mockery of Deadpool and that they had lumbered the character with increasingly bad artists.

So.. Yes. He absolutely has a point when it comes to DC's management, but I think his points in particular were lost in amongst the ridiculous levels of ego and the pretty outrageous attacks he made on other artists in the industry, which he unfortunately decided to make at the same time as taking a stand. Constructive criticism is all fine and good between artists, but his statements were just utterly childish.

Date: 2013-05-02 08:30 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] shadur
Wasn't that the rant where he tried to slag Alan Moore to score imaginary points with himself?

Date: 2013-05-02 05:00 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
Probably, even though - from what I recall, Moore actually had more of an argument against him, given he was dicked around whilst working for Liefeld at Extreme/Awesome/ Cool 90's Adjective Comics.

Not that I imagine Moore took notice and/or gave a fuck if he did.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:22 am (UTC)
captainbellman: Blacksad! (Lizard - Blacksad)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Firstly, that opening quotation has given me a huge new respect for Rob Liefeld. Wow.

Secondly, I'm astounded at the variety of character of this comic. I mean, just...in this day and age, not only are three or four of the main characters of a different body type to the mainstream of female comic-book characters, but one of them is now partly disabled and the other is of advanced age, and that's treated as no big thing compared to the fact that they love each other.

Above all, there's no mean-spirited jokes or close-minded characters pointing out how 'different' it is or anything! The publisher didn't even make a grand PR announcement to state what they were doing and how progressive they were now! They just did it!

And the writing!

And the ART!

How the HELL is a Liefeld-created book suddenly massively superior to anything put out by Marvel or DC?

HAS THE WHOLE WORLD GONE MAD?!?
Edited Date: 2013-05-01 09:22 am (UTC)

Date: 2013-05-01 09:31 am (UTC)
biod: Cute Galactus (Default)
From: [personal profile] biod
"Liefeld-endorsed", not created, even though the original character was.
Keatinge's the writer for this and Campbell's the artist.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:32 am (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Wellllll, on a technical level if Liefeld created the character he also created the book. But I get your point. Keatinge and Campbell appear to have worked a miracle with this.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:37 am (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
I think it's still fair to call this a Liefeld creation. It certainly wouldn't exist without him providing the basis and giving Keatinge and Campbell the go-ahead.

I think he also deserves some kudos for allowing this, given I couldn't imagine every creator would be entirely okay with the idea of someone taking a character of theirs and doing something very, very different with them. And Liefeld's done this with a character he still owns, which shows he must have some faith in the creative team.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:51 am (UTC)
biod: Cute Galactus (Default)
From: [personal profile] biod
Oh, there's no question that Liefeld deserves all props for letting the team work their magic and for giving them the character in the first place.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:55 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] shadur
If it helps the cognitive dissonance, think of it as a data point in the graph that demonstrates how Liefeld's comics and characters get better the less active input he has in the process.

Date: 2013-05-01 09:24 am (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
Besides that, the above exchange featured the hero going to absurd lengths to bring back someone she'd loved, only for that loved one to give her a very good talk on why that can't happen and how death has to be final.

In your FACE, Quesada!

Date: 2013-05-01 10:51 am (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Rarely has this CAD strip seemed more apposite

Date: 2013-05-01 02:37 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Not!Wonder Woman loves Not!Etta Candy. And it's good.

Date: 2013-05-01 06:48 pm (UTC)
lucky_gamble: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lucky_gamble
This...is good ;_;

Robbie, I was so wrong about you.

Date: 2013-05-01 11:33 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] kd_the_movie
From what ive been following about this series through scans_daily, it was wonderful. Thanks to all the users who posted it.

Incidentally by following the entries here on S_D, I see that apparently Glory's memories of Emilie directly reference the "memories" Riley was having of Glory all the way back in the first issue of the relaunch.

Date: 2013-05-02 06:25 am (UTC)
blunderbuss: (Default)
From: [personal profile] blunderbuss
Look, I agree that this is awesomely well-written and touching and lovely ... but someone killed themselves because they were aging and their partner wasn't? And they wanted them to find someone new, despite the fact that their partner would never want to have a relationship again?

Just ... holy shit that is such a horrifically selfish thing to do.

Date: 2013-05-02 06:16 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
Well, it's a human thing. No-one said that course of action is entirely rational, or even right.

Date: 2013-05-03 06:16 am (UTC)
blunderbuss: (Default)
From: [personal profile] blunderbuss
Oh sure, it's a perfectly human feeling to hate and resent the fact that you're aging and your partner isn't, but there's a million ways to fix that other than 'let me kill myself so my partner blames themselves forever'.

With a gun too, for extra trauma.

Date: 2013-05-04 03:46 am (UTC)
silverzeo: (Default)
From: [personal profile] silverzeo
Yeah, I noticed that too...

She didn't want Gloria she her age older, but WANTED to her to see her brain blasted around the room?!? At least she could have taken a less gruesome death, like over medication or something...

Date: 2013-05-03 04:22 am (UTC)
sharky_chan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sharky_chan
Yeah...I can't speak about the series or relationship as a whole, since these scans are literally all I've seen of it, but I really hope it's not glorifying Emilie as much as it feels like here.

From what I can see, it's like "Glory went crazy and became a mass murder(?), but isn't Emilie just so great for still loving her?" and I'm like "Wow, doesn't anyone have words for Emilie too? She's not a fucking martyr -- she acted completely out of selfishness."

Which isn't to say she should be demonized for it, but still...as you said, it's just so selfish. And I really hate when media glorifies this sort of crap (once again, maybe that's not the case here, but that's definitely the vibe I'm getting and it's definitely turning me off to the series) :(.

Date: 2013-05-03 06:18 am (UTC)
blunderbuss: (Default)
From: [personal profile] blunderbuss
I know right? The scans are treating it like a happy ending, instead of the incredibly fucked-up situation it is. Gloria would be heavily justified to slap her in the next panel and chew her out for it.

Date: 2013-05-03 12:55 pm (UTC)
sadoeuphemist: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sadoeuphemist
What the hell, c'mon, you don't slap the suicidal and yell at them for being suicidal. You're acting like it's always a rational decision to kill yourself, made by people who are of sound mind. A lot of the time it's an inescapable compulsion that can't be overcome without psychiatric treatment.

Date: 2013-05-03 02:55 pm (UTC)
sharky_chan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sharky_chan
My complaint isn't with what Emilie did (yes, it's terrible and sad but yes it happens), it's how the comic seems to be putting her in the heroic role of Glory's savior/redemption rather than acknowledging how she (further?) psychologically damaged her lover.

Once again, this may not be the case for the whole comic -- I'm entirely basing this on these scans since they're all I've seen -- but it seems to be over-simplifying the situation, treating Gloria as the only one who should feel remorseful, and falling into one of my least favorite tropes which is "kissing is the same as apologizing."

So while I don't think physical abuse is appropriate in any relationship under any circumstance, my gut reaction is that the portrayal of Emilie, who has presumably had years to come to terms with her actions and the fallout it had for the people she loved, is glorified here. Which once again may not be the case -- that's just how I'm reading it from these pages.

Date: 2013-05-04 12:05 am (UTC)
sadoeuphemist: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sadoeuphemist
You yourself said Emilie acted completely out of selfishness. That's not a motivation that it is productive or even meaningful to ascribe to the suicidal!

That is the entire problem with your reading of these scans: you are looking for ways to ascribe blame. Who is responsible, who is at fault, who is being unjustly glorified, and so on. And ascribing blame is a terrible, fucked-up attitude to have when it comes to mental illness!

This is a story of a woman who has had a long and incredibly violent life and frequently terrible life, who has watched her friends and lovers die around her - who blames herself on some level or another for their deaths, for bringing them into her life in the first place - who has gone into the depths of the dead in an attempt to bring them back. And she has discovered that even though they are all dead for good, they're all happy and they all love her and want the best for her and no one blames her at all. Trying to suggest that she should now flip the script and start blaming her dead lover instead is horrible and regressive! The point of the scene is that this sort of needless blame and guilt and recrimination does not exist past death!

Date: 2013-05-02 03:32 pm (UTC)
rainspirit: (damiel)
From: [personal profile] rainspirit
I'm right with some of you here on how torn I am that I love this comic so much.

Riley. ;______;

"Death is wonderful."

Right in the heartstrings, there.

Date: 2013-05-03 08:55 pm (UTC)
cloudtrader: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cloudtrader
Is this going to be collected in a trade? Because wow, I need to own this.

Date: 2013-05-04 08:17 pm (UTC)
skywaterblue: (art school perverts)
From: [personal profile] skywaterblue
o_o what is this awesomeness.

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