thanekos: Yoshikage Kira as Kosaku Kawajiri, after the second arrow. (Default)
[personal profile] thanekos posting in [community profile] scans_daily
There's just not enough time and space for it.

Those parts that can't be told in full have to be in part, with just enough to get the idea across.

Last month's Doctor Strange did this well with the Empirikul's attack on 616's magic.





" Magic is under assault.

" Magic is DYING. "

Native magic's fight against outsider science was told with casualties, double-told with narration over action:



The tale turned inexorably towards the latter's victory.

Still Doctor Strange fought on with everything he could- even other, tangential stories:



The tide turned backwards..



.. and then forwards again.

(His bit about despair's tied into his origin- he hates magic because his parents were sacrificed by sorcerers to a demon, so he swore himself to its destruction.)

Against the rock that was Stephen Strange, he crashed. The two lay..

.. and then he rose. This telling was over; magic had lost, again.

(Lost the first round, at least. The second, well, that's started this month.

Pagecount's 6 of 20.)

Date: 2016-04-30 12:10 am (UTC)
kamino_neko: Tedd from El Goonish Shive. Drawn by Dan Shive, coloured by Kamino Neko. (Default)
From: [personal profile] kamino_neko
Empirikul?

Is this another magic vs science sitch?

Date: 2016-04-30 12:19 am (UTC)
janegray: (Default)
From: [personal profile] janegray
Shaman and Talisman? I remember them fondly from the Alpha Flight series. Did they die or were they rescued? I hope they survived :(

Date: 2016-04-30 12:35 am (UTC)
beyondthefringe: (Default)
From: [personal profile] beyondthefringe
So far, none of the magic types we've seen -seem- to be dead, thankfully. Which is good since I like most of them.

This is the sort of storyline which always depresses me, though... the thought of all this cool, ancient, mystical, weird stuff being destroyed.

I hope the resolution brings a restoration of some sort, and not a "magic lives, here's a clean slate" kind of thing.

Date: 2016-04-30 12:45 pm (UTC)
janegray: (Default)
From: [personal profile] janegray
Thanks :)

Date: 2016-04-30 12:48 am (UTC)
majingojira: (Kyon Sad)
From: [personal profile] majingojira
I really, really, REALLY hate the idea of Science vs. Magic. It just doesn't make sense.

Date: 2016-04-30 05:18 am (UTC)
lilacsigil: Scarlet Witch asleep, "Kiss myself awake" (Scarlet Witch)
From: [personal profile] lilacsigil
Me too. There are some canons where Magic involves belief rather than empiricism, so it would work there, but Marvel isn't one of them.

Date: 2016-04-30 11:29 pm (UTC)
majingojira: (Squirrels)
From: [personal profile] majingojira
Even then, unless the magic works like dream logic, it can still be analyzed and studied. It's like that brain bug that writers have that there's no scientific understanding of emotions when that's actually a decently studied area of psychology.

And I think Dumbing of Age or its predecessor had a gag comic about that outdated dichotomy.

Date: 2016-04-30 01:44 am (UTC)
zylly: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zylly
I'm not overly fond of some of the retcons to how Doc's magic works (or the fact that he apparently can't eat normal food anymore), but I do like these bad guys quite a bit, and Doc's overall personality here.

Some of the new magicians introduced in follow-up one-shot were also a lot of fun.

Date: 2016-04-30 05:12 pm (UTC)
tugrul: That Chest (Default)
From: [personal profile] tugrul
Which one-shot? A Dr. Strange one-shot that is related to this?

Date: 2016-04-30 05:25 pm (UTC)
zylly: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zylly
Yeah. Just came out this week along with the new issue of the Doc. Doctor Strange: Last Days of Magic.

Date: 2016-04-30 07:48 pm (UTC)
tugrul: That Chest (Default)
From: [personal profile] tugrul
Thanks. I'll have to check it out.

Date: 2016-04-30 11:43 pm (UTC)
zylly: (Hercules approves!)
From: [personal profile] zylly
No problem!

Date: 2016-04-30 01:56 am (UTC)
cainofdreaming: b/w (Default)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
So, did these guys try to 'cleanse' the Serpent Crown? Darkhold? This end of the Rainbow Bridge? Exemplars of the Octessence?

Because I can't see stepping on all those toes ending so well.

Date: 2016-05-01 07:03 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
I was thinking that myself. In the next issue Jericho Drum specifically talks about spells drawn from dimensions the Empirikul have "purified" not working anymore. Well, Strange got in-depth tutelage in the lore of the Shiatra Book of the Damned from Marie Laveau and then later had the original Darkhold itself in his possession for lengthy study. The consequences of using such would make the bleeding eyes and weird growths side effects look like a mild head cold in comparison, but he has resorted to using them in less desperate situations. And I sincerely doubt these eyeball goons have successfully invaded Chthon's domain.

Date: 2016-04-30 06:10 am (UTC)
dr_archeville: Doctor Arkeville (Default)
From: [personal profile] dr_archeville
Mahatma Doom?

Date: 2016-04-30 07:41 am (UTC)
akodo_rokku: (Default)
From: [personal profile] akodo_rokku
He's in the one-shot that came out after this issue. He's apparently the only surviving monk from the monks who once trained/served Doom, and has become a sort of Buddhist anti-Doom.

Date: 2016-04-30 02:56 pm (UTC)
dr_archeville: Doctor Arkeville (Default)
From: [personal profile] dr_archeville
Holy flurking schnit, that sounds awesome!

Date: 2016-04-30 09:14 pm (UTC)
mesmiranda: (jump)
From: [personal profile] mesmiranda
I would read that in a heartbeat.

Date: 2016-05-01 07:05 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
It's a great origin, but I don't recall Doom doing anything to the monks after having them forge his armor. They'd pretty much become his willing servants at that point, it wasn't an Ancient One/Baron Mordo kind of situation.

Date: 2016-04-30 02:30 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
Kind of annoyed by how the mutant powers of Illyana seems to have been shut down as well.

Date: 2016-05-01 07:08 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
To be fair, they do involve portals to a magical dimension that these guys could have theoretically invaded or cut off.

I'm more raising an eyebrow at her physical invulnerability not making an appearance as she's burned at the stake—that's a gift from the Elder Demon Gods. In fact, a lot of her magic spells are.

Date: 2016-05-02 01:46 am (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Aren't those Elder Gods (probably unrelated to the Elder Gods) currently dead? Though with Legion's retroactive erasure of himself from the world outside of Blindfold's mind that might have changed. Which would also mean that they destroyed the world...

Date: 2016-05-02 04:24 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
I've not seen the issue that happened in, but color me extremely skeptical of David Haller's ability to actually permanently kill billions-of-years-old spiritual entities. And Illyana has been using magic quite capably since, which would indicate there's still something out there for her spells to invoke.

I don't know if they've ever positively identified any individual Elder Gods that Belasco worships, but my impression is that they're the same ones that were behind Xenogenesis back in an old Defenders story—Belathauzer, Vera Gemini, and their cohorts. Little brothers, sisters, and assorted nongendered siblings of Chthon and Set that fled from slaughter by the Demogorge at the same time as those two did.

Date: 2016-05-02 08:35 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Well, this was during the same time frame he literally put the universe in a box. So his omnipotence was kind of eating its wheaties. And she could just be using the two other parts of how Marvel magic works - personal, potential and invoking.

They looked wholly bog generic demons when they appeared in this story. There wasn't even the one Gibborim (who, I think, have also been credited as 'elder gods' with no actual relation) that had been part of the group in X-Infernus.

Date: 2016-05-03 03:31 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
Marvel's history does have an abundance of elder gods. There are the capitalized version exemplified by Gaea, Atum, Chthon, and Set that was mostly wiped out or exiled about 500 million years ago. The N'garai, said to be offspring of Chthon conceived or created after that event, infested the earth at a more recent date and were separately exiled by parties unknown, leaving Sa'arpools and cairns behind for a future return. The Gibborim from Runaways also had their turn of dominating the planet at some point before humanity arose. Then Shuma-Gorath ruled the earth about 2 million years ago in the days of homo habilis, drafting various demons and spawn of the Elder Gods into its service (though presumably it predates this version of the universe and was only able to manifest in the 616 universe comparatively recently).

Date: 2016-04-30 09:14 pm (UTC)
mesmiranda: (flames)
From: [personal profile] mesmiranda
So when's Doctor Strange getting a long face with noticeable high cheekbones and curly hair?

Date: 2016-05-01 12:01 am (UTC)
zylly: (Dragon Man)
From: [personal profile] zylly
I'll accept that if we also get his white stripes back.

Date: 2016-05-01 07:11 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
I'm just hoping they don't give him eyes on opposite sides of his head.

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