laughing_tree: (Seaworth)
[personal profile] laughing_tree posting in [community profile] scans_daily

Post a joke from this year's comic, it's a massive offense. Show one from the 80s? All in good fun. Reagan as snake-man, clearly a joke. Mockingbird in a t-shirt that says feminist, comics are ruined. -- Nick Spencer

"...or do I? After all -- I have to get out of here, don't I? I have to be there at the capitol. According to the vision -- which means I did guess it right."

Date: 2017-08-10 11:36 am (UTC)
nyadnar17: (Default)
From: [personal profile] nyadnar17
The older I get the weirder and weirder the whole "no killing/killers are dirty" thing is to me.

This isn't some mugger, its not him engaging in random super heroics. That man is a literal fascist dictator who took over the country in am armed coup. How is there any moral problem with killing him in armed combat at all? How is letting him live "heroic" or noble?

Seems like a good event, but that moment was weird and dissonant to me.

Date: 2017-08-10 12:01 pm (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
Yes, it is weird. It is really weird with Sane! Captain America. It such a degree there was a question about whether he killed anyone during World War II.

This turned around. "Captain America killed Nazis during World War II" became an excuse for everything.

Date: 2017-08-10 12:53 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] matrix_dragon
To be fair, Miles is a kid.

Date: 2017-08-10 01:21 pm (UTC)
speedingtortoise: Happy Platypus (Default)
From: [personal profile] speedingtortoise
I feel the same. His (and Nadia's) decision here seems kinda selfish to me. It's all well and good that he emerged from this as a person who values life in all it's forms and who represents the better part of humanity, but a ton more people are probably going to die because he refused to kill a mass-murdering dictator who has taken over the world. That being said though, he IS just a kid who has been through some pretty rough circumstances, so he can't really be fully blamed for not making the absolute best decision here. I mean hell, I don't think that my 16-year-old self would have mustered the courage to even end up in such a situation.

Date: 2017-08-10 03:18 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] palgrave_goldenrod
Miles is sixteen. If you were mentally and morally capable of killing anyone -- even a fascist dictator -- at that age, well, I'm not sure what that would say about you or the world you live in, but I dare say there's not many who would share that quality.

Date: 2017-08-10 07:47 pm (UTC)
leoboiko: manga-style picture of a female-identified person with long hair, face not drawn, putting on a Japanese fox-spirit max (Default)
From: [personal profile] leoboiko
There's also the entire Black Widow background—her recent arcs have been all about the horror of child soldiers, it makes every sense for her to try as hard as she did to not make Miles into a killer, and his final decision works as the payoff of Natalya's death.

Date: 2017-08-10 03:20 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] palgrave_goldenrod
Plus, Miles says it himself: "I'm not a killer." That's a personal statement, not a declaration of universal morality.

Date: 2017-08-10 05:46 pm (UTC)
superboyprime: (Default)
From: [personal profile] superboyprime
Keep in mind they know Cap's not in his right mind because of the Cosmic Cube. So killing him is essentially killing an innocent pawn.

Date: 2017-08-11 07:21 pm (UTC)
balbanes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] balbanes
Especially when Option B is a big battle where lots more people (on both sides) will die. How is that better?

Editorially, the "no killing" rule exists to preserve established characters. Better a thousand faceless mooks die than a popular hero with decades of backstory. IRL, I suspect that rule is a legacy of aristocratic bullshit. It's fine if pawns die, but god forbid you kill the king.
Edited Date: 2017-08-11 07:21 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-08-12 08:55 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
I wouldn't be aghast at Natasha, or even someone like Stark or Clint Barton killing him under these circumstances. But I'd say it's a cause for horror any time a teenage kid is put in a situation where he feels like killing is the answer, and I'm including real world 18-year-old recruits in a volunteer army in that statement.

Date: 2017-08-12 10:29 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] deh_tommy
(a)He's never killed anyone before, and he's too scared to start now. I think he's also of the belief that that doesn't matter who is killed, the killing itself is wrong.

(b)Killing Steve Rogers here would just mean his cohorts would take over, hold him up as a martyr and double down on everything that Steve was holding back on.

(c)If the Heroes do manage to win (which they will, but they don't know that) or somehow undo what happened during this event, Miles would still have the trauma of murdering someone on his mind.


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