Date: 2018-01-19 02:34 pm (UTC)
lucean: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lucean
Have to be honest, I enjoyed the hell out of Dark Avengers. The characters had really fun dynamics and Osbourne just fit in that role so well.

I'd actually argue that Dark Reign in general holds up pretty well when looking recent comic book events.

Date: 2018-01-19 02:45 pm (UTC)
goattoucher: (Zod)
From: [personal profile] goattoucher
I respectfully disagree.

At it's core, this centers around Norman Osborn: Known lunatic and murderer. It is, let's be kind and say "unlikely" that people would forget that and make him a hero -and- give him a high profile government law enforcement position just because he killed somebody else that the general populous did not like.

This is not Trump, where some like him and some hate him. Nobody likes Osborn. He did not have a large contingent of supporters that thought his victims had it coming, or that killing pretty blondes would Make America Great Again.

I appreciate that the entire point of Dark Reign was to have the guy in charge have a meltdown, but that could have been done with established characters with less notoriety: whose crimes were less public.

And then, after all the flaws with Osborn as a choice of leader, we get the fact that the check he was written was so blank, that the oversight was so non existent, that he hired not only bad guys, but some of the most notorious psychopaths in the country to work for him. Putting Bullseye in a purple suit does not mean that he is not still Bullseye, and that somebody will not have to answer for putting a mass murderer on the government payroll (publicly) in the fullness of time.

Perhaps I am a cynic, but the decisions they made were so fundamentally stupid that I have to think that editorial was trying to foment interest by outraging fans. The choices were intentionally outrageous to get fans long-since tired of events to hate-read this series.

Date: 2018-01-19 02:50 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
'I have to think that editorial was trying to foment interest by outraging fans. The choices were intentionally outrageous to get fans long-since tired of events to hate-read this series.'

I think that's a stretch even if the premise is implausible. Something like 'Cap is a secret fascist', yeah. But there's not a lot in DR that leads me to believe Bendis was trying to actively piss people off.

This was also coming off of the heels of Warren Ellis's Thunderbolts run which was a big success so a lot of readers were already fans of the "Norman Osborn in charge" concept.
Edited Date: 2018-01-19 02:55 pm (UTC)

Date: 2018-01-19 08:32 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] balbanes
I find this very believable in light of Trump. People like Trump because they believe he's "on their side," not because of his sterling character. Osborn is making the same play here.

If Dark Reign had come out today, I daresay it would be accused of being a political attack.

Date: 2018-01-19 02:35 pm (UTC)
goattoucher: (Brimley)
From: [personal profile] goattoucher
So very, very awful.

Date: 2018-01-19 02:52 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
I really liked this incarnation of Norman. There were some great character moments with him. I would have liked to see the Ellisbolts for a few years before this happened, though.

Date: 2018-01-19 02:54 pm (UTC)
lordultimus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lordultimus
You know, the basic idea of "Thunderbolt's without the redemption arc" does have merit. There's just something off about the execution.

Wasn't Bendis the one who wrote the story where Osborn was revealed to be the Green Goblin?

Date: 2018-01-19 02:57 pm (UTC)
cyberghostface: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cyberghostface
He was but Mark Millar also had Norman get arrested around the same time with his Marvel Knights story. Near the end there was a retcon of sorts that had the two go with one another.

Date: 2018-01-19 03:16 pm (UTC)
stubbleupdate: (Default)
From: [personal profile] stubbleupdate
The best bit about Dark Avengers is the conversation between Norman and Bob about the Void. It's the bit that made the most sense to me.

Date: 2018-01-19 03:36 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] strejdaking
Why does Osborn have a keyboard on his desk without computer?

Date: 2018-01-19 06:31 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] long_silence
"Just come in and join this team, you'll be breaking the law and be arrested if you don't"
Karma's a bitch ain't it Carol?

Date: 2018-01-19 07:07 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile]
Dark Reign has always impressed me for both the potential wasted, the amazingly poor characterization and down right idiotic actions of every character involved.

The only redeeming chapter of this story was the Avengers Initiative by Christos Gage. But Gage can seem to work with anything

Date: 2018-01-20 06:43 am (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
Some of the follow up to this (also written by Bendis) had people blaming Tony Stark for Osborn being "in charge." No, that doesn't really make sense. But Brian Bendis wrote it. He often writes that other people off screen want to blame the Avengers for something that wasn't their fault.

It sometimes works. I've read a fanfic (or two?) where Maria Hill was lying to Tony Stark about Washington DC wanting to blame the Avengers for the Hulk's Las Vegas rampage (in the ILLUMINATI special). It was a trick so Stark was use his "shoot the Hulk into space" plan.


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