scans_daily | Robin OYL Part 2

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Robin OYL Part 2

WARNING! This is the infamous story written by Adam Beechen that is remembered for what it did to the character named Cassandra Cain. Eighteen scans will be had of three issues (Robin #150-152).

There is only one thing reading this story will culminate in if you're a fan of Cassandra Cain:

The only way to survive after reading these scans is to remember, the character is in a better place and written by better writers now. Keep repeating that to yourself and you should be okay. Remember these positive thoughts.

When we last left Tim he had been given an ultimatum: Break out David Cain or else Cassandra Cain dies. Tell anyone and Cassandra Cain dies! So Tim does the logical thing. He goes to Blackgate to break David Cain out:

Thankfully after through the remainder of the security due to it being installed by Wayne Enterprises. And math is there anything it cannot do?! Wait the ninjas gave Tim this long a time table to break David Cain out? Well at least they're nice ninjas and not extreme with a very short time table.

Anyway, Tim breaks David out and knocks him out. He then interrogates David when they're near the meeting site. Cass's pop plays innocent not knowing what's going down. And seriously, the strange thing is re-reading this David Cain seems in character throughout this. It's only later in Beechen's Cass mini does the whole OOC David show up.

So since David doesn't give him the right answer, Tim knocks him out again. So they arrive and at first nobody is there. But being that this is ninjas they appear out of nowhere and begin fighting Tim. It becomes a numbers game and after a mysterious someone tells the ninjas to attack a weak spot of Tim they exploited earlier in part 1, they capture Tim.

And so the great mastermind of this arc stands revealed. Can you guess who it is?

I remember when first reading this. What this scene above reminded me of:

#150 ends with Cass holding Tim up and pointing the gun at her father. But just when you think it can get any worse? Oh but it does! IT DOES!

Heh.. Crazy crime crusade.

So did Linkara get his magic gun from Cass? I'm just saying. It looks the same caliber and fires more than one round. Plus it disappeared and suddenly Linkara began wielding one. Just saying.

After this EVIL act (as if the reveal wasn't the topper), Tim has had enough and with both arms (wait.. his shoulder was broken how did he do that?) beats down Cass's ninja posse. Oh and he blows some up too like literally killing them. Now we know who the bad influence was on Steph who blew up people up in the first issues of her series. Tsk tsk..

So it all comes down the epic showdown:

.....

Yeah, I think this one (besides the villain reveal) made me the most angry at this arc. I mean come on, Cass's ablities DO NOT WORK THAT WAY! If they did any thug would have been able to beat her. The only time she had that sort of problem was when the metahuman rewired her brain to talk. Ugh just ugh. But we're almost done. I have to finish this. *deep breath*

So Tim and Cass brutally fight each other both landing some vicious blows on the other. In the end before a victor could be claimed:

And Tim jumps off from the explosion Die Hard style to the ground to find some dead ninjas (not by his hand honest) and David Cain missing. So in final summary we're given this at the end:

But it doesn't end there. So Cass is a major threat to the Bat Family right?

Oh no, if you had the gall to stay around one more issue you where treated to one more slap in the face.

And thus ends how Cass became a super villain. Dare I continue and post her other villain ventures and the revelation she was on Slade juice? I hope you all survived without getting into a rage fit. I know I almost went into it after looking at these pages again.

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*facepalm*

Of course, this is sorta retconned by Deathstroke giving her 'crazy serum; or something. None of which fixes any of the gaping plot holes, of course.

*sigh*

Thanks for confirming my instincts. What a bunch of crap.

HEARTBURN....LOTS OF HEARTBURN, OH GOD, OH GOD...CAN'T READ THIS. *scrolls past the rest of the pages and only reads your commentary*

even the art makes me ill...Cass is so weird looking here.

*sobs at the end*

Oh, you've GOTTA do more. The Supergirl dry humping has to be seen to be believed.

And here, along with Tim's fight with Jason in BftC, is proof that Stephanie Brown is smarter than Tim Drake. Tim, you're facing someone who can and will kick your ass...

What would Steph have done in either of these situations? What she always does. You see, she did learn what Bruce teaches...

Tim, there's a reason Bruce gives you all those weapons and gadgets. You're up against a superior fighter who also happens to be unarmed. Not fighting fair? SCREW THAT. You don't see Bruce or Steph worrying about that.

And he does the same damn thing against Jason in BftC. You're carrying a small arsenal, Tim. USE IT.

In fact, I can even fanwank how Cass was so thrown. Her body language reading was conflicting with her tactical reasoning. Her brain was thinking "OK, need to be ready for the explosives and batarangs. He knows he's outmatched, so he's gonna us them... He's just hitting me? WTF? No, no, no, he can't possibly be doing that... Must be hallucinating... That's it. He's used some sort of gas that's making me see things..."

Really, isn't Tim supposed to be the smartest of the Bat Kids?

I used to be angry. Now that the damage has been undone, I can poke fun at it.

Actually Tim does use his gadgets to beat the ninjas. He attempts to use gas bombs on EVIL! Cass but she stops him.

The point is Tim's supposed to be smart. That's his thing. A decently plotted story would have had him use that brain of his. A good writer could have come up with a way for him to overcome a better fighter besides just slugging away.

Beechen ignored Tim's actual strengths, here.

The Supergirl thing WAS as bad as Beechan IMO since it implied that Tim was perfectly OK with giving a fully-powered Kryptonian the information to beat a non-super powered member of HIS family without telling Bruce or Babs or Alfred. I mean - Superman is Batman's closest friend in the hero community and Bruce still keeps a Kryptonite ring just in case. Tim just sent Kara after Cass like she was another villian (and the issue made no sense anyway what with all the gratuitous fanservice and deus ex machina "crystals" that enabled Supergirl to beat Cass).

I think what made it worse was that during that period in Supergirl's book Kara was written as so obnoxious and unlikable it was hard a reader to root to beat ANYONE - especially a much maligned former Batgirl.

I have no problem with Tim giving Kara the info. He knows the Supers keep to the No Killing rule, and Cass needed to be stopped some way. It's not like he was sending Black Adam after her.

The thing with that issue is... Well, that sequence. Pretty much anything else in that issue was completely knocked out of my mind because of... that. I was just like "Huh? What? Um... Huh?"

Wrassin frassin I scanned #14 and it'll be posted tonight. God help us all.

I don't really have anything constructive to add here. I just saw an opportunity to use this icon, like, totally appropriately. :{

The rage knows no bounds - the only way I fanwank it is if this so-called "Cassandra" is an entirely another character from the "Cassandra" that appeared in Batgirl (that's how I explain how Black Mary Marvel in Countdown too). It helps I think (as some said in your previous post) that Beechen did such a piss-poor job of it making any sense, that the idea of "Cass as villain" got no traction from even the people inclined to dislike her and they abandoned it - quickly (within months actually which is very quick for DC Editorial).

I think to this day that much of the pettiness and obnoxious that Didio & Company have exhibited whenever Cassandra Cain's name is mentioned has a lot to do with the fact that the Cass as Villan Editorial decision (and it was an Editorial idea- Beechan said as much from the start) backfired on them in Countdown proportions. DC never likes to admit they were wrong and having to back-pedal on the Cassandra Cain thing so quickly (to the point where their #1 ret-con man Geoff Johns was given the job to do it) makes them still a bit bitter about the character.

Other horrible things:
1) The way Bruce reacts. This is the man who completely lost his sh!t when Cain sent him home video of Cass' first kill when she was a kid. This is the man who threatened both Superman and Superboy to get Kon away from Cass. This is the man who gave Cassandra an unlimited bank account, a penthouse apartment and anything else she wanted to stop being Batgirl because he felt guilty about he had used her like Cain - as a weapon. ALL OF THIS was in the Batgirl series. Which Beechan could not bother to read - nor could Eddie Berganza and Peter Tomasi (two of DC's top editors who worked with Beechan and who he credited as coming up with the Evil Cass story). And there's no excuse for that.

2) The very fact that they nerfed Cassandra's abilities in fighting (which are far above virtually anyone on the planet) shows basically that the whole idea of making Cassandra evil had NOTHING to do with her and everything to do with Tim and building him up. If it had been a story about Cass going bad as the main plot it would have involved Bruce, and Babs. But they (who were closer to Cass than Tim ever was) were nowhere to be found. Which mean she was basically sacrificed as a character and as a hero to make an already uber-talented popular male Robin look good. And that says volumes about the mindset that exists at DC.

If fact I'd half wager if that Devin Grayson Batwoman series (which some say was the reason Batgirl was cancelled) had been ready to go, instead of the Deathstroke retcon, they would have just killed off Cassandra instead (we know there were already plans to bring Babs back as Batgirl while Beechan's failed Cass mini-series was going on).

The plan to put Babs in the cowl was before all that. It was Paul Dini's idea, with Alex Ross doing the costume design. Dini almost got it through, until it was decided that they needed a disabled superhero. The costume design, itself, tells us when this proposal took place...

They still liked the design, so they had Ross tweek it a bit and used it for a revival of Batwoman. This is why Kate Kane is a redhead.

But, it would seem somewhere along the line it was decided that Batgirl needed to be closer to the DCAU one, even if she wasn't going to be the actual DCAU one, so Dini ended up damaging Cass, anyway, just by doing his job on the animated series too well. Because, look who was introduced during OYL: Potential Batgirl #1...

It was also shortly after all of this that we saw Rip Hunter's chalkboard where he was trying to figure out everything that happened to time after Infinite Crisis. The chalkboard was used to hint at things coming up. Looking just below "Death of the Supermen," we see someone was coming back: Potential Batgirl #2...

And, among the bits of Silver Age continuity restored was Bette Kane being Bat-Girl. And, her cousin was the new Batwoman, making her Potential Batgirl #3...

Then, Morrison went and skuttled Cass's heel turn with his first storyline upon taking over Batman.

Say what you will about Morrison not respecting what the folks writing the Bat books during OYL, but I'm pleased he forced the whole Cass as Dragon Lady leader of the League of Assassins to be stopped. While I have my gripes with some of what Morrison's done, forcing Robin: Wanted to be retconned and getting Cass back on the good side isn't one of them.

So, while we wound up with four candidates for Batgirl going into Batman RIP, Barbara wasn't one of them.

What I meant was that Oracle: The Cure (which was obviously a set-up to get Barbara walking again before they changed there mind) seemed to have been greenlit not long after Beechan's mini-series was just starting (or even prior to that) and we have Didio's own words that Barbara was THIS CLOSE to returning as Batgirl after RIP (even Bryan Q. Miller IIRC has said Stephanie as Batgirl was a last minute decision).

We also know that part of the the decision to cancel Cassandra's title and sideline her had to do with the push for Batwoman coming out of 52 (since apparently at the time the Bat-Editors you couldn't have both Cass and Kate at the same time). Given the timeline we have from OYL on, even following the Deathstroke retcon, I think DC had basically (for reasons only they know, probably because they wanted a Silver Age-ish Batgirl to go with Hal Jordan, Kara Zor-El and Barry Allen) given up on Cassandra Cain (even as she was appearing in The Outsiders), even during the period where they issued the Beechan mini-series (and for the conspiracy minded one could point to the idea of having Beechan in particular write her again a sign they didn't expect/want her to succeed since he was the one single writer certain to alienate the fanbase who would read a Cassandra Cain series).

He didn't say "after RIP," just that it was as close as Dick dying in IC. His description of the process, and the reason it didn't happen, matches Ross's account of Dini's proposal, how far it developed, and why it didn't happen. Therefore, it would seem unlikely that these were two different events. We know, not only from Ross's account, but that very costume design, that it had to have been before Kate was introduced.

The timing is even perfect for when Cass's series was cancelled. What would have been a Dini written Batgirl series starring Babs became a Batwoman series that got stuck in Development Hell. Note Cass's series ended a lot like Linda's Supergirl book did, with the title character just quitting the role she had for years to give way to the original.

Then, we had Misfit, spunky fun redhead who wants to be Batgirl introduced during Cass's heel turn. Then, Morrison forced that heel turn to be dropped. We had Bette waiting for that Batwoman series to get off the ground. And, they decided to bring back a dead character that just happened to be very Barbara-like except for her hair color.

They were leaving their options open.

The accusation that they invested the time, energy, promotion, and money to a six issue mini series with the intention of it failing, just to spite Cass fans, makes no sense at all. They're not going to greenlight a series with the intention of it failing. Was having Beechen writing it a bad idea? Sure, but so was having Loeb write year long story arcs. Sometimes even the worst ideas sell well. Geoff Johns could have make the most ridiculous retconning actually work, as he would have done it with a great story instead of a Wall of Exposition, but he was too busy writing about 56 other books at the time.

Beechen did try to fix the mess, but you need a Geoff Johns for this, so the damage was done. After that, the best option was to give Cass some time off to give everyone a chance to forget about all that, then bring her back into things. Charlie got Beechened by McKeever, quite possibly costing her the Batgirl spot. Tieri almost Beechened Steph's return, but that one was caught before it was too late and she was given over to Dixon, her creator. You can even see the exact spot in Gotham Underground where she was yanked away from Tieri.

Yes, I'm making Beechen a verb.

I used Beechen as a verb all the time.

I just use it as an expletive.

I keep the RAGE in check by simply telling myself that this is just Earth-A Cass enjoying her vacation.

Bruce: And if the best Cassandra could do to drive a wedge between us is criticize your costume color...

Me: I DARE you to finish that sentence with a smile you son of a bi-

Bruce: *smiling* That's just proof of how disturbed she was.

Heh, Bruce ducked that question like a thrown Joker-Fish.

Sometimes I think about comic book continuity, and how it can be a headache for the writers and editors even more than for the readers and fans.

Beechan once said, "They didn't present me with a rationale as to why Cassandra was going to change, or a motivating factor. That was left for me to come up with and them to approve. And we did that. But as far as to why the editors and writers and whoever else made the decision decided that was a good direction, I honestly couldn't answer."

It's not like ROBIN OYL was one massive "They just didn't care." It's more of a "Hey, maybe this will work, and it is not like Cassandra has that many fans otherwise we wouldn't have cancelled her book."

Thing is though, Cass's ongoing wasn't canceled due to bad sales. Her book was ahead of numerous others and was solid at around a certain number (above 25,000 maybe even near 30,000 which in that time period was way above cancellation numbers). Theories or not evidence suggests that DC didn't want Cass as Batgirl anymore. The reasons we don't know fully why but we know they did. It had nothing to do with low sales. Not ever. If it did Tim's own book should have gotten the axe along with her's since they where neck and neck in sales.

The thing is though that Beechan also credited HIS editors (Eddie Berganza & Peter Tomasi) with helping him create this plotline and when it first started Beechan went on record saying that it was a "natural" progression of the character to anyone who complained. Now Berganza and Tomasi were at the time two of the senior Editors in the company AND two of the people in the braintrust that came up with the idea of Evil Cass (along with Didio I assume), if they had any problems with how Beechan was crafting everything they could have just stopped him at any point (or at least told him to read some of the old Batgirl series) but they didn't. So however much Didio would later go on to introduce Beechan at cons as "the man who made Cassandra Cain evil" (to which Beechan was booed) it was Editorial who was behind him all the way - even when they started getting called out on the problems in characterization from the get-go.

So I stick with "They just didn't care" and didn't expect the backlash (to be honest I still think many of the Editors - not writers - are befuddled that CC still has so many fans). I understand how others might see differently though.

"It's not like ROBIN OYL was one massive "They just didn't care."

Actually, that's not true. In this arc we saw a half dozen things that were contradicted by the last arc in Batgirl alone. Cass couldn't read, couldn't monolouge, was well aware of the fact that Cain trained others and loved her father and her training.

And don't get me started on the plot holes. Just this post alone...

Tim spends 11 hours breaking into Black Gate by himself, so how does he get Cain out?

So to clear his name of murder, Tim frees a mass murderer and allows him to escape?

Oh, and the video clearing his name? Well, Cass drops his *real* name during it. Think the cops might notice that?

Also..."Hey, maybe this will work, and it is not like Cassandra has that many fans otherwise we wouldn't have cancelled her book."

Wrong. Cass' book was selling steady around 23K. Catwoman, Hawkman and Firestorm all sold less and were all brought back OYL. Cass' follow up mini series sold only about 4K less than Steph's current series. Oh, and 'Oracle: The Cure' meant to return Babs to Batgirl status was written at the same time of the mini.

I think people automatically assume that because DC is a business, they won't make stupid decisions. But people forget that DC is being run by fanboys with virtually no oversight. Scuttling Cass wouldn't be much issue at all, really.

I think people automatically assume that because DC is a business, they won't make stupid decisions. But people forget that DC is being run by fanboys with virtually no oversight. Scuttling Cass wouldn't be much issue at all, really.

Businesses make stupid decisions all the time. Just looking at our economy for the last four years is proof. That was the end result of a lot of years of a lot of businesses making stupid decisions.

As for the "fanboys," this was before Morrison started writing Batman. This was one of the Hired Guns. Once the actual fanboys got involved... Morrison's very first story skuttled Cass's heel turn. Johns then did the "Deathstroke drugged and brainwashed her" retcon. It was the fanboys that put a stop to the whole thing.

Then there's Dini, who was the one lobbying to put Barbara back in the cowl. No nostalgia motivation, there, just part of turning the DCU into his own DCAU.

"As for the "fanboys," this was before Morrison started writing Batman. This was one of the Hired Guns. Once the actual fanboys got involved... Morrison's very first story skuttled Cass's heel turn. Johns then did the "Deathstroke drugged and brainwashed her" retcon. It was the fanboys that put a stop to the whole thing."

Yes, they back peddled...after massive fan outrage. Cass then bounced into limbo, then Outsiders and back to limbo. Grant likely just sideswipped Cass as leader of the League than any intention to help, given that the story never once referenced Cass and despite using virtually all of Batman's history, the most he's ever done with Cass was a cameo.

But, you were accusing the "fanboys," meaning Morrison and Johns, of skuttling Cass. They had nothing to do with that. Again, the one pushing to make Babs Batgirl, and therefore Cass not Batgirl, was Paul Dini.

The argument that a lot of folks wanting Babs as Batgirl was creators being nostalgic isn't accurate. What they wanted was Dini's DCAU Batgirl, which the Silver/Bronze Age Batgirl was not. Dixon's Batgirl: Year One retconned the DCU Barbara Batgirl into the DCAU one. So, what happened to Cass wasn't a result of Iron Age vs Silver Age, but DCU vs DCAU.

Cass: I'm tired of being used! I'm tired of being lied to! Aren't you?

Tim: Batman's never lied to you, Cassandra, and he's never lied to me!

Cass: Oh yeah? What about letting you think the girl I lo... I mean, you love, is dead, instead of off recovering, somewhere?

Tim: What?!!

Jason: Hi. I couldn't help but overhear...

Tim: Where did you come from?!!

Jason: Well, my dad first met my mom in...

Cass: I think he means more immediately... Like the jacket, by the way.

Jason: Thanks. So, Blondie's alive and Brucie didn't tell Tim? Yeah, sounds like him...

Cass: I know, right?

Jason: So, where's she at?

Cass: Africa... Heading over there as soon as we're done here.

Jason: Can I come?

Cass: Sure. You can help me make sure this boy behaves during the trip.

There are certain clichés that really aren't worth using in comics anymore.

"There is no more (blank)."

"I know who I am now."

"You can join me. You just have to kill (significant person) first."

"We are the same."

"Do it!"

"Once you cross the line, there's no going back."

Even ignoring the decision to turn Cass evil, the story itself looks like a cliché-ridden mess.

So.. Not only does the story kind of fuck up Cass - Which I wouldn't mind so much if it were a viable idea and carefully thought-out villain (because she could've gone that way if she wanted), this fucks up everything Gabrych established about Cain - That he had Shiva mother the child because his past attempt was a failure and Shiva was already shaping up to be the best of the best when she mothered Cass - Cain had a bunch of kids just waiting in the wings anyway? Why would he even care about Cass, then?

Also, I don't know where DC dug up Freddie Williams III from, but I wish they'd drop him down some deep, dark pit. His art was ugly during Morrison's Mister Miracle mini, and it's ugly here.

Deathstroke's drugs did all that eh? Sorry. Can't buy it. I can accept a giant yellow space bug possessing Hal Jordan, that's fine. I can buy that reality-punches retroactively made Maxwell Lord a bad guy, that's possible. But this went far beyond just terrible characterization to the point of not making any fucking sense whatsoever and pretty much destroyed reality in Cass's wake.

Unless maybe it did destroy reality in her wake! It's far from the craziest thing in the DCU. Maybe it was made from the blood of Donna Troy or something.

Also, it seems trivial compared to the fail that is the main plot, but what the hell is with the ugly art? Especially on the last couple pages — does Bruce's expression change at all? All I see is the same toothy half-grin no matter what Tim says.

Unless maybe it did destroy reality in her wake! It's far from the craziest thing in the DCU. Maybe it was made from the blood of Donna Troy or something.

Well, Dark Angel did get involved in this...

Alfred isn't familiar with The Clash? Balls he isn't.

My theory about DC editorial's decision to make Cassandra Cain a villain for Robin in this storyline is that they felt her character needed to be a bad-ass again.

From the moment readers were shown Cass's background, she'd been a combination of exquisitely lethal assassin and sweet, well-meaning young person. The Batgirl series showed her working out her conflicts with her past, each of her parents, her language deficiency. All the while, that magazine’s sales dropped—a fairly natural progression, especially after the departure of the original creative team.

What could juice the character? The editors might have decided that the most potential lay in bumping up her lethal side again. I doubt that was meant to be a permanent change, but it definitely didn't work.

As folks have pointed out, Adam Beechen wasn't responsible for that decision. He was responsible for the script, which made a formerly non-verbal character the most long-winded Republic-serial-style villain I've seen in a long time.

When I was getting back into comics after a long absence, this was one of the first stories I read. Not know anything about Cass, I read it. And I kind of enjoyed it.

Now I've read Cass' Batgirl run and know about the character, and holy crap does this make me die a little bit inside.

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Robin OYL Part 2

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