Date: 2023-11-21 06:12 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] mazway_75
Let me guess: After Mid-Nite leaves, we see Ray jumping off her suit?

Date: 2023-11-21 06:18 pm (UTC)
superfangirl1: (Default)
From: [personal profile] superfangirl1
Aw man. Jean still killed Sue is still in continuity. I was hoping that event would be erased already.
Edited Date: 2023-11-21 11:22 pm (UTC)

Date: 2023-11-21 06:23 pm (UTC)
laughing_tree: (Default)
From: [personal profile] laughing_tree
But didn’t the New 52 undo Identity Crisis, with Ralph and Sue alive again?
Edited Date: 2023-11-21 06:24 pm (UTC)

Date: 2023-11-21 06:36 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
So after nearly two decades since the publication of Identity Crisis, and developments in the depiction and treatment of mental health since then, surely Jean Loring would be treated in a more respectful ma-
Wait. Never mind.
Sigh.

And apparently Ivy Town has a gothic mansion repurposed into a prison / "mental asylum". Just like Gotham!
As opposed to, for example, some sort of building built within the last hundred years for the express purpose of humane and ethical treatment of people with mental health problems.
(But then, if Jean was put in an actual, functional facility where she could possibly get actual help, how would she inevitably escape and go on a murderous rampage?)

Date: 2023-11-21 06:58 pm (UTC)
thanekos: Seiga Kaku from Touhou 13, shadowed. (Default)
From: [personal profile] thanekos
Like many writers of his youth, Geoff Johns benefits from artists making his work look a lot better than it is.

Date: 2023-11-21 08:04 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] blueprintstyles
I am 99% sure Ralph and Sue are alive again.

Date: 2023-11-21 08:48 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] tcampbell1000
Jean Loring has never been treated terribly well.

Version 1: Silver Age superhero writers tended to regard male heroes' romantic subplots as an inconvenient necessity at best. Jean in the original Atom stories was a sometime helpmate to the Atom, conveniently reluctant to marry until she got estabilshed in the law, and otherwise about as interesting as rain-sodden pulp.

Version 2: The closest that "classic Jean" got to agency was when Ray sprang his secret identity on her less than 24 hours before they were to be married. He did this, by the way, by transforming to the Atom in front of her, thinking as he did so, "She's already had two breakdowns, I hope this doesn't cause a third!"

...

Just...just gonna let that last paragraph breathe a minute, there...

...

She actually considers not marrying Ray for a few hours because secret-keeping is toxic, then decides this is one of the things that needs to fall under mutual forgiveness. That's fine, and it's actually true that a healthy marriage needs that. But the whole thing is ridiculously rushed, and it doesn't help that the people she's talking this through with, her bridesmaids, are also disguised superheroes and therefore also actively gaslighting her. (Sue Dibny is not among them, though she shows up in the wedding party later.)

Version 3: In the Eighties, Jean appeared just long enough to get caught in an affair, basically so it'd be justified for the writers of the series to recast Ray as a small-scale barbarian hero in the Amazon with a barely-legal alien woman clinging Frank Franzetta-style to his leg. I guess the Warlord DC Comic and Conan movies had done well enough to justify this attempted pivot. I won't hold it against Ray that he got written as somebody's bitter midlife-crisis fantasy for a year and change, but I gotta say, as soon as Jean was gone, she was instantly forgotten.

Version 4: All the bad things to say about Identity Crisis have already been said (who still wanted this?) and she's basically remained the same ever after that, albeit slightly more fun when Eclipsofied. The irony is that only by reaching cartoonish levels of dissociation has Jean managed to get any attention paid to her internal life. But that attention has not extended past "Aw, LOOK! She thinks this is romantic, isn't that TwIsTeD?!" And it sure hasn't tried to be consistent with any of the other three versions of the character, let alone tried to make them consistent with each other.

I feel bad for her...but not as bad as I feel for characters who used to be treated well and then got the shaft. Y'know, like Sue Dibny.

Date: 2023-11-21 08:54 pm (UTC)
huntleyhaverstock: Joel McCrea as Johnny Jones, aka "Huntley Haverstock," in Alfred Hitchcock's FOREIGN CORRESPONDENT (Default)
From: [personal profile] huntleyhaverstock
With all of the above valid criticisms acknowledged...

1. I found Jean's delusion about Ray sneaking in on all her visitors to be kinda clever/poignant/creepy. It's not like she lacks good reason to suspect that!

2. I like that she snaps into being intelligent, analytical, and helpful when asked about Eclipso. It ain't much, but it's something.

3. The art's pretty decent -- especially the part where she's talking about being infected by Eclipse, and half her face is in shadow, mimicking the classic Eclipso half-face look.

But also, Geoff, your Killing Joke/Watchmen obsession is showing...

Date: 2023-11-21 11:15 pm (UTC)
bradygirl_12: (brady (hoodie))
From: [personal profile] bradygirl_12
Yeah, Arkham's got a twin

Date: 2023-11-22 12:12 am (UTC)
starwolf_oakley: Charlie Crews vs. Faucet (Default)
From: [personal profile] starwolf_oakley
Just because Jean Loring is locked away in a mental institution (not a spa, as Diane Chambers would say) doesn’t mean she’s there for “accidentally” kill Sue Dibney and torching the body.

Date: 2023-11-22 09:11 am (UTC)
shakalooloo: (Atom)
From: [personal profile] shakalooloo
Which state is Ivy Town currently in?

Date: 2023-11-24 03:47 pm (UTC)
zylly: (Default)
From: [personal profile] zylly
I get it’s probably delayed synergy, but I’m not a huge fan of Beth’s OG Doctor Mid-Nite derivative look. Her yellow and black costume was great.

(And where’s Pieter these days while we’re at it?)

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