aeka: (Huntress/Power Girl [otp]:)
[personal profile] aeka posting in [community profile] scans_daily
Originally when George Perez drew these two characters (Crisis on Infinite Earths is the only work I know of where he drew them both), he gave them more or less the same generic face he gives many of his female characters.

For the upcoming Worlds' Finest comic that he's currently drawing, Perez decided to do something different and model Huntress and Power Girl after his two friends Jana (JC Marie), a professional model and Margie Vizcarra Cox, a cosplayer. Admittedly I have issues with artists modelling characters after RL people, but that's a post for another day.

From Crisis on Infinite Earths, luscious pretty art. I especially love his attention to detail:

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I especially love how he drew the pre-Crisis Helena Wayne (she was one sexy lady!):

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For Worlds' Finest, Perez did this piece for a T-shirt:

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I'll just go ahead and admit, while I do appreciate the effort at giving them different faces, I do think his Huntress and Power Girl looked better when he didn't actually model them after people he knows.

↑ In addition to an already terrible costume that looks like something out of a 1980s Scifi anime, Peege here especially makes me a sad sad panda on all scales. ↓

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I expected better from Perez. ;_;

Hopefully the interiors look better. :/

Date: 2012-03-19 01:35 am (UTC)
featheredserpent: from Amazing Spidey 653 (perverthulhu)
From: [personal profile] featheredserpent
That's not Peej, that's Cybill Shepherd in a Buck Rogers cosplay.

Date: 2012-03-19 01:37 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
...Those are different faces? ...Okay, if you say so.

The NEW new costume is...interesting. I mean, the asymetrical design makes her stand out, but I'm not sure if I'm a fan of the p. I think it would work better as an upper-case P than a lower-case p. I like that they're breaking up the white a little bit with the blue stripes, but wouldn't it help more if she had bigger blue boots instead of having blue soles?

I do have to ask, though--why do you hate that he's using models that he knows? I mean, how is it different from an artist using a photo reference or using a celebrity face? I would think that would actually help make the art better.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:10 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
Celebrities, sure, I can grant you that--but with models or cosplayers, I look at it as just the artist being able to draw unique and different faces that feel real. I mean, if you found out that an artist you liked used reference like that, like a, say, Alex Maleev, would you say that he isn't as good of an artist after finding that out?

As for Hepburn--maybe it's because I don't think I've seen a lot of movies with her in them, but I don't see her at all when I look at Hughes' Catwoman covers. I see Catwoman. That's damn near the iconic Catwoman to me.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:28 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
True, true, and being able to do that on his/her own is great too--I'm just saying that as long as the artist gives each character something unique in their face, body, and expression to make them feel like a unique character next to the other, whether the artist was able to do that on their own or was able to replicate another person.

Also, I don't think 2 is really the case. There's a reason why I chose to mention Maleev--he uses local models or actors for that. He literally hired actresses to play as Spider-Woman and Scarlet when he was working on those two books.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:44 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] darkknightjrk
I think that was kind-of the hypothetical I was trying to get across to you--if you enjoyed someone's art in a comic, and then you find out that they used models for reference that were not famous by any stretch of the imagination, would you find the art to be bad then?

Date: 2012-03-19 02:02 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
I think the current run on Invincible Iron Man and (obviously) Greg Land are pretty notorious for their photo referencing, and then especially Land because of the subject matter and manner in which he uses the photos.

So I think I understand where you're coming from to a degree, but some of my favourite books over the years have used a photoreferencing style; Maleev, Tony Harris, Alex Ross.. But then I think they put actual work into still maintaining their style, even when working from photos they've taken; Ross obviously likes to think he's the Norman Rockwell of comics, Harris keeps things caricaturised. Maleev paints and makes his images really gritty.

To me, that's valid and great use of working from photos.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:33 pm (UTC)
cleome45: (logo1)
From: [personal profile] cleome45
I'm not actually a fan of photorealism, but I don't object at all to artists working from photos. So long as they bear in mind that even photos can be inconsistent, and need more than just simple copying to be convincing in illustration.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:46 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
Well, again. Alex Ross, Tony Harris, Alex Maleev. All of them use photography that they create themselves in their work. Contrast and compare with Greg Land, who copies his figures from identifiable public sources and reuses the same poses from the same photography over and over and over.

Ross isn't quite photoreal; There's, again, that whole Rockwell feel to his paintings that feel very idealised, glossy, and more than human. Maleev, again, has his style. Harris works his own style into his images very well. All of them do more than copy, as opposed to Land.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:31 am (UTC)
weber_dubois22: (Default)
From: [personal profile] weber_dubois22
Uh, yeah, I'm not seeing a problem with their faces unless your the kind doesn't like the 80s style of cartoon realism.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:56 am (UTC)
omnipotent: (!!)
From: [personal profile] omnipotent
For some reason Power Girl now vaguely reminds me of Paula Deen. Cringe.

Which, off topic, but that reminds me that one time I followed a Paula Deen recipe for fried chicken that called for a whole cup of salt. A little voice told me that an entire cup of salt was way too much, yet I put it in anyway. One bite of the chicken and all I could think of was my impending heart attack. I didn't eat the rest.

Date: 2012-03-19 03:08 am (UTC)
thefiretonight: (Default)
From: [personal profile] thefiretonight
I've got a couple pics of WF's interiors up from the New 52 Panel at Wonder Con here:

Click over the pics to make them bigger. :)

Date: 2012-03-19 05:50 am (UTC)
sherkahn: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sherkahn
I hate to say it but I prefer the similar faces the Crisis art had.

Date: 2012-03-19 01:04 pm (UTC)
pyrrhocorax: It is XS! She is running! (XS)
From: [personal profile] pyrrhocorax
Oh my god Power Girl looks like a conservative MP or something. All she needs is a suit and some pearls and she can put her creepy frozen smile to good use.

Date: 2012-03-19 01:16 pm (UTC)
junipepper: (jumplines)
From: [personal profile] junipepper
Alex Ross uses real people as models; it seems to work for him...

I remember Helena Wayne as having a long-ish, narrow face. It was a very distinctive look, not a classic beauty but strong and attractive. Unfortunately I don't seem to have any of those books anymore. I always loved her original costume. It was as impractical as any in the DCU, but for some reason I just really like the way it looked on her. But the current costume is okay. I guess because it's so much better than some of the iterations of the Bertinelli costume, it doesn't bother me much.

I can deal with Helena's face being whatever it is now. But Peege -- I just don't see Peege. Also her costume is still bad. Bring back the big blue boots and gloves, I say! At least there would be some balance. I don't like the logo and the whole shoulder thing. Maybe if there was less red?

Date: 2012-03-19 02:22 pm (UTC)
cleome45: (Default)
From: [personal profile] cleome45
If the new faces are meant to show more individuality than the old, I'm not seeing it.

Date: 2012-03-19 02:49 pm (UTC)
mrstatham: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mrstatham
Going from the links to the ladies Perez is using, I don't see how he arrived at the art he did, somehow.

Date: 2012-03-19 03:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile]
For those of you who can't see the differences in the face, it's mostly in the noses. PJ has a thinner, pointer nose and Helena has a wider, rounder nose under her cowl/face thingy. PJ's jawline might also be a little bit rounder fuller but it's difficult to tell and her lips are thinner.

Bear in mind that the new art appears to be traditionally done without the clean inks that the comic pages have. If he's working at a smaller er, resolution isn't the word for traditional but I just woke up, he wouldn't get as clean and defined a look as he would with something more large scale.

Personally I welcome anything that isn't generic!face especially when it comes to women in comics. Men are drawn with a lot of variety and wrinkles and interest and women....all look the same quite often. I would also love to see differing body types on both sexes but I'll take what I can get.

Date: 2012-03-19 09:09 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Yeah, I agree the faces on the more recent pic look more... "fake grin" than the Crisis pics, but I think that's at least partly down to the medium used.

Date: 2012-03-20 01:59 am (UTC)
kamino_neko: Tedd from El Goonish Shive. Drawn by Dan Shive, coloured by Kamino Neko. (Default)
From: [personal profile] kamino_neko
I like Peege's costume a LOT better than the one from the actual WF cover we've seen. Still don't think she needs the P built into it. but at least this one works better than the old one, if only because it doesn't have the 'lookit me, I used to be Supergirl!' aspect.

(I actually have more of a problem with Peeg's hair than her face.)

Date: 2012-03-20 02:02 am (UTC)
kamino_neko: Tedd from El Goonish Shive. Drawn by Dan Shive, coloured by Kamino Neko. (Uuuh...)
From: [personal profile] kamino_neko
the old one

OK, I'm making an assumption here that may not be true. 'the other one' would be more appropriate.


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