More Avengers Arena interviews and covers
Sep. 28th, 2012 01:54 pm
Maybe it's because I thought of pitches with these characters that were similar (more "Hatchet"/Survivor Man-based, less emotional manipulation, more organic deaths) and have been beaten to it. I don't know, but to deal with my indigestion, I have to air it out. Here are the covers and some speculation I've been tossing around.
#1 Cover
Variant @1, which got all sorts of reactions.
#2


I think we all saw a version of this one coming.
#3 Variant
The new interview actually does link the Braddock Academy to Captain Britain, so that answer questions.
These quotes I especially hope hold true:
"I wanted to do it because it's a teenager story with stakes and guts. The first challenge of any story is to make the reader care. Care about the characters. Care about the themes. Care what happens in the end. I took the job because I want to make readers care about these kids and what they've been through."
"Arcade doesn't make anyone do anything. That's not his game here. And within that, we're going out of our way to make sure the characters have justifiable reasons for all of their actions. This is a story about what a person is willing to do to survive. It's about how far they'll go to keep themselves and their friends safe."
(This one especially, because that's how I'd run it, just more survival stress oriented)
"Laura isn't a mindless killing machine anymore. In fact, she goes out of her way to avoid killing. Being tossed into Murder World won't change who Laura is. "
"Obviously the characters who survive longer will get more of the spotlight, but none of them are cannon fodder. They all matter to the story in a real way."
It could be good , but it could VERY easily fall to crap. Issue #2, the first death, will be the ultimate test. If it fails, it will fail hard. If it succeeds, then it might just last long enough to tell its story. The solicit is thus:
AVENGERS ARENA #2
DENNIS HOPELESS (W) • KEV WALKER (A)
Cover by CHRIS BACHALO
Variant cover by MIKE OEMING
• ANNIHILATION’s Cammi vs. Deathlocket!
• AVENGER ACADEMY’s Hazmat vs. Deathlocket!
• Who the heck is Deathlocket? And who dies in this issue?
• Plus: Who are the students of the Braddock Academy?
32 PGS./Rated T …$2.99
The series teeters on the edge of a knife,. Hoping for the best, preparing for the worst.
And now, with the current information, some speculation on 'survivability'. (or "What I'd do if I was assigned this to write"), which may ensure that the opposite happens, but screw it! This is how I'd do it and how it "should" happen! So says me!
From Space:
Cammi: I believe we have a catalyst to get to killin' . It's my speculation, based on the solicit, that Hazmat will be saved by Cami who snipes/blindside's Dethlocket before threatening to do the same to Hazmat at issues end. Reading her origin and her story, this girl is not mentally stable and I can easily see her wracking up a body count of at least 2, maybe more. Because of this, she is unlikely to survive the event herself. My take: Dead Villain Walking, but she'll have to earn it first. I'd also have her finale be her getting the Darkhawk armor before being purged of it and killed.
From the Streets:
Nico Minoru: Leader of the Runaways and vastly powerful (if people remember that she's able to not tap into the spell limiting options of the Staff of One anymore after the upgrade her Grandmother gave her). Hopeless' assessment is pretty good, but when push comes to shove, she'll defend herself lethally. And woe betide anyone who angers her. The girl can be creative with her punishments. However, if she goes down, the Runaways themselves will fall apart. This make some want to see her survive this ordeal. It will leave her even more jaded than before, but I want her to live damnit! The Staff of One might be able to cheat her death now that she's much more tightly connected to the staff. Instant healing, time stop recovery, teleport to saftey--something. If she is injured and her staff taken, that may lead to her first kill this thing. As the last time it happened, the staff got pissy and summoned a draconic horror to devour the offender--who was a practiced sorcerer. I doubt any of the kids would be that well prepared. My Take: her death would come at too high a cost. Let her live, damnit!
Chase Stein: He claims to have killed before, but the veracity is nebulous at best. He certainly can be at least apparently ruthless enough, and has good instincts to survive. However, he just got back Old Lace, so killing him immediately would be rather odd and off putting. He may have Old Lace with him, but that hasn't been confirmed. He may have his fistigons 2.0, he may have his X-ray specs, we don't know. even without these, he can be formidable (if goofy). His tech expertise might be useful if they're willing to scrap the sentinel a bit (doubtful). Still, his death would not lose much, and I can think of several heroic sacrifice scenarios that would do him in well. My Take: Probably gonna die, but unlikely to occur early on.
From the Avengers
X-23: Yeah, she's a bit too high profile to die without it being a blatant "SEE! NO ONE IS SAFE!" especially if it happens early on. given the strength of her healing factor, even then, she would be easily "killed' and then come back later on. There's also the Trigger scent thing to worry about if Arcade does decide to 'ramp it up' as it were. She'll defend her friends, but will not kill unless she has to. My Take: Lives.
Reptil: Another one with TV exposure, and a hero at heart. His priority will be on escape over fighting others. With the gem now full accepting him, his death is unlikely. Even if it does occur, he may disappear afterwards like Crusader (remember him?) or appear to die only for the gem to revive him. He's the chosen one of a dinosaur dimension, who has a fated death. Even if he dies here, he will likely come back. At least, I'd have him die and then come back a short while later. He'd leave behind a girlfriend and that dimension. My Take: He'd live in the end, but he'd have a very close call or 5.
Hazmat and Mettle: These two either live together or die together. Their romance was one of the best things in Academy. Honestly, I fear that would put them on the chopping block for many writers. It's an easy way to do it. Both would be driven into homicidal rages if it was done. Hell, Hazmat's body, if it were left around, could kill people vicariously. Mettle is physically the strongest one there, next to the Sentinel, and his inability to feel/taste/smell could work to his detriment (tracking devices, proximity grenades snuck on his back, etc). Hazmat might go nuclear again and kill several at once. Both are powerful, that is a mark against them, sadly. My Take: I'd want to keep them alive, but continual peril would be the name of the game. No matter what, they're in it together.
Juston and the Sentinel: Juston's is the least well known of these, but his appearances in Academy got me interested in him and his own series was actually rather fun. He'd leave behind a "Missing Mom" plot and a girlfriend (as well as Dad and younger brother). He has a pretty big bulls-eye on him. He's a nice guy who screwed up once in an effort to get back at bullies, and regretted it ever since. I doubt he'd be able to order the Sentinel to kill, but it might have other ideas. My Take: Justin dies, but then is revived as the Sentinel fuses with him with the words: "Primary Directive: Unit will not abandon Justin. Not Ever. No Matter What." He becomes an Omega Sentinel. He might die again later, but that scene is just too juicy not to use.
Dethlocket: Honestly, the best way to take her would be to introduce us to her, make us care in issue #2, then off her . That's how I'd do it as the first death of the series. Anyone else would be cashing in the check of another writer.
"Axbro": As dubbed by 4chan, nothing else can be said about him, but one rumor is that he's one of Colossus' kids from the Savage land. I can't speculate any further than that, but that may be enough of a connection to lt him live. It depends on how far he goes to survive if that is true. That could do him in.
"Not-Hazmat": Presence of a second character in a containment suit does not bode well for Hazmat (and thus, not for Mettle). Given I have a stronger attachment to the older characters, I have a bias to keeping them alive over this new one. But the presence of overlap is a sign that one of them is going to die.
The Braddock Acdemy:
We know nothing of them beyond it being basically a privileged private version of AA in Britain. This may make some of them more ruthless than the others. There's 3 remaining slots and we don't know who they are or what their alignment will be. But honestly, I'd kill all but one or two of them if I had to. I'd make people care, then kill them. That's the real trick. It's the best bed to put any villainous character who will try and survive according to Arcade's rules. Given their probable privilege, layers of disbelief about what's happening are definitely coming.
Arcade:
Simply put, he cannot be allowed to live long after this. At best, I'd kill him either in the finale (or pre-final issue) or, to buck trends, have Arcade be the first death. The heroes manage to find Arcade almost immediately, but not where the kids are. Leaving everything the kids do completely on them. That would be a twist and half. But either way, he's gotta die. And it has to be from one of the survivors for it to mean anything. If Wolveirne, Tigra or Hank Pym tracks him down and does him in, it just won't work. Even the other Runaways wouldn't have the same oomph emotionally. It's gotta be them. And he's gotta die.
Man, all this talk about death just gets me thinking of an "Ideon: Be Invoked" AMV. I even hear some of its theme music when looking at the covers and reading about it. Now that was a Kill'em'all done well. (Note: This video is NOT for the faint of heart! You have been warned!).
Though I do hope we avoid LolTomino style deaths. IE: "Sudden character depth added, then BLARGH I AM DEAD!"
I hope there's a reset button for this series. Keep the emotional trauma and their lives. To live is to suffer, and it's suffering (witht he attempts to overcome that suffering), not death, that really sells. Death being only a spark for the suffering of others. Its why the "Women in Refrigerators" thing is used and why it's seen as poor form. It's an overpriced way to get what is wanted.
Those are most of my thoughts on it. I needed to air it out. Part of me wants to like this series, but the other part wars "Remember how you held out for Beechen's Cassandra Cain?" Let's hope things turn out better. But I'm bracing for the worst.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-28 08:18 pm (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:18 pm (UTC)Especially when it comes to two of the characters that basically got me into comics back in 2003. If Marvel decides to kill off Nico Minoru, then I am literally not spending another penny on Marvel. Ever.
Also, can someone please start suing Marvel for these shitty cover rip-offs? The first one was fine, but seriously; WE GET WHAT YOU'RE GOING FOR, MARVEL. You don't need to explicitly show you're ripping off two properties that feature children killing one another.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:39 pm (UTC)I honestly like the homage covers. It works a bit better than the Loner's "80s Movie Homage" covers did, IMO.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:25 pm (UTC)Unless I hear great things about this, I don't think I'll be picking it up. It just seems sorta generic. And weird that Arcade is the one behind it. Didn't the Academy already kick his ass? And if that's why he's after them, then they should be at the bottom of the very long list of people who've kicked Arcade's ass.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:52 pm (UTC)Oh, and one of those kids is basically Wolverine's daughter. I don't know what the current situation between Logan and Laura is, but hurt the kid and I imagine Arcade wouldn't have long to say his prayers. It's just dumb on every level.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:26 pm (UTC)I hope that Axbro lives, and is officially named Axbro.
I'm with you on the reset button quite frankly, while I have nothing against killing of characters, I feel like it's best done with characters explicitly created to die (ex: X-Statix had a very high turnover rate, but it never felt cheap or like a waste of a good character because it was well written a part of the book's hook) not with characters that have been created by others and have tons of potential. Possibly the only death I would want for this book is the Juston and the Sentinel one you outlined, because my heart would melt and I would die blubbering like a baby.
I'm curious about the status quo of the series; Is Braddock Academy a new Murderworld set up by Arcade? Is Arcade working from behind the scenes to manipulate the Academy, which is actually legitimate? And I'm still not sure about Arcade's involvement in this, he doesn't seem like a subtle enough villain for this. He'd probably get bored after about five minutes of the high school drama, flick a switch, and turn the whole thing into a Westworld homage, complete with Yul Brynner.
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Date: 2012-09-28 08:44 pm (UTC)My favorite Reset Button actually involves replacing Arcade as primary antagonist. I'd use the Grandmaster and/or The Champion. Elders of the Universe can get away with killing and then reviving characters on a whim. And have a lot more patience than Arcade.
Thanks for the vote of confidence in what I'd do. Makes me happy as an aspiring writer (I'm setting this down now so I can either go "Ha! I told you so!" or "No! This is how it SHOULD have been done!"). Now let's hope that is the path they go down. "But it's obvious!" some may say. To which I say "Yes, because it's next logical step and you know it. Also, nothing else could top that."
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Date: 2012-09-28 09:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-28 10:03 pm (UTC)Why can't they just let them go peacefully instead of rubbing our faces in it.
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Date: 2012-09-28 10:16 pm (UTC)One of the problems with characters like these is that other writers tend to forget the developments.
As to why they announce it so widely, well, they want your attention. They'll get it by whatever means necessary. Even repugnant ones.
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Date: 2012-09-28 11:15 pm (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2012-09-29 04:22 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 12:14 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 12:21 am (UTC)The sad fact is,if Hazmat dies, she could take the whole island with her. It's an incentive to keep both her and Mettle alive. Or shunt this to a VR program/alternate reality.
Edit to add: Of course, if she doesn't detonate, I'll call BS on the whole thing.
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Date: 2012-09-29 12:44 am (UTC)It is missing a point both stories it is ripping off understood. While some might die due to misunderstandings and pressure, a game like this cannot work without some genuine psychos in the mix. That is why Hunger Games had the careers. That is why Battle Royale had Kazuo and Mitsuko. Avengers Arena is nothing but heroes (unless Baddrock Academy has the monsters) we have nothing but people the readers don't want to see die. That's a good way to develop apathy for your story.
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Date: 2012-09-29 12:49 am (UTC)I'm going to point to Cammi again, as I outlined. Of the established ones, she's the scary one.
But you do raise a good point regarding impetus. We do not know the mechanisms that will A) keep them on the island, B) get them to consider fighting each other at all. If they are not up to par in that first issue, things will not bode well.
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Date: 2012-09-29 01:56 am (UTC)I mean, alls i'm seeing here is murdertimes = DRAMA! ANGST! SURIVIVAL! so you know what, fuck this noise, i got enough murdertimes and child abuse in my real world news.
also Darkhawk is definitely dying in this book because he's pretty much the closest thing in this crowd to an adult and we all know what happens to adults in shitty angsty grimdark YA stories.
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Date: 2012-09-29 02:41 am (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2012-09-29 05:29 am (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2012-09-29 03:27 am (UTC)I'm going out on a limb and guess that Arcade isn't the actual big bad of this series, and it's going to turn out the kids are in the Mojoverse or something like that.
Both Sentinel and Runaways are two books that I absolutely took delight in when they were launched and the idea of Nico, Chase, or Juston just fills me with dread. Although I will admit your idea of Juston as an Omega Sentinel does sound kinda badass.
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Date: 2012-09-29 04:36 am (UTC)Usually I don't even like Mojo, but here I think he'd totally work.
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Date: 2012-09-29 05:09 am (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2012-09-29 06:01 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 10:16 am (UTC)(no subject)
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Date: 2012-09-29 08:17 am (UTC)Given how editorially-driven things at the Big Two are have been in recent years, when TPTB are promoting something with "kids die!" as the big hook, my faith in which way it's ultimately going to go is not with the writer.
Still passing on this.
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Date: 2012-09-29 02:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 10:20 am (UTC)I'm just tired of storylines where they gather up superfolk and kill them off to cull the numbers.
Was sick of it in Teen Titans. Was tired of it in Salvation Run. Was fed up of it in the Initiative.
Just this once can't everyone live? Even though the threat of death that they're under won't seem real if some of them don't die, I guess. *sigh*
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Date: 2012-09-29 01:45 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 10:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-09-29 11:14 am (UTC)I'm really, really worried about this series. And upset. And annoyed. I look at the cast list and see a whole swathe of "s/he was my introduction to comics" characters. I feel like Marvel's seeking to trade on that... bring us all a'running because we fear the deaths of our entry-level friends. Like Marvel's going to make money off our anxieties.
You, my fellow commentors, have mentioned your faves in this bunch... for me it's Darkhawk. His original series came at just the right time for me as a comic book reader, giving me a character I could follow from the ground up. I've kept up with Chris Powell ever since and own every single appearance he's made in comics (right down to single-panel cameos) and the (extremely sparse) mechandise on which he's featured. Now I'm going to be buying this series and hating it all the way.
So yes: solidarity, my friends. I, too, am bracing for the worst.
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Date: 2012-09-29 02:14 pm (UTC)Second,thank you for the solidarity. I share mine with you.
I'm sorry my analysis listed Chris on the chopping block. It's my honest speculation. Though it'd be a Gurren Lagann level sacrificial death, agt the very least.
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Date: 2012-09-29 01:49 pm (UTC)I don't even want to know what happens in it. If the characters I love live it just means that somebody else's favorites will die. And everyone will be rooting for the new characters to die just so the already established characters will have a better chance of survival. It's just gross. "'Kill or be killed' is pretty much the perfect allegory for high school," Hopeless said. I have to know, did Hopeless go to the high school in "Heathers" or something? And how does a handful of kidnapped kids being pitted against each other by a psychopath remotely resemble the high school experience?
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Date: 2012-09-29 02:09 pm (UTC)Though part of me fears that, even though we're making our objections rather clear as to why we're wary/fearful/disinterested or even "Anti-Interested" in this, the blame will fall on the characters once again, because editorial is like that.
I'd love to see many of these characters together interacting. But not quite like this.
But if this crashes and burns like Young Allies did (sadly), then a positive outcome is not exactly what I'm picturing for all those involved. Hell, a petty "So, you don't care if they live or die, eh? Alright, they ALL DIE! How'd you like them apples!" might also occur as a worst case scenario, rather than them escaping early and thus averting at least 6% of the slated deaths.
If that occurs, we'll know that it was indeed emotional blackmail at its very core.
(no subject)
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Date: 2012-09-29 09:30 pm (UTC)Because I'm not familiar with his work.
And I'm not really sure it's appropriate for a writer to make his debut by killing off a bunch of established characters. I don't care if it was editorially mandated, it's just not cricket.
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Date: 2012-09-29 09:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
From:no subject
Date: 2012-10-06 03:55 pm (UTC)And I do think Arcade will be an early death. The scariest cars have no drivers.
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Date: 2012-10-06 04:19 pm (UTC)Let's hope the early-Arcade-Death speculation will bear fruit.