Astro City #10 - "Victory"

[arbre_rieur]

"They're inherently juvenile, I'm told. They're simplistic. They're just an adolescent male power fantasy, a crypto-fascist presentation of status quo values ... what charms me about that objection to superheroes is the way it points out in the guise of criticism, what to me is the greatest strength of the superhero genre -- the ease with which superheroes can be used as metaphor, as symbol, whether for the psychological transformation of adolescence, the self-image of a nation, or something else. A genre that can do something like that -- is that really a limitation?" -- Kurt Busiek

That's from the introduction to the first Astro City trade, so it would have been written in, what, sometime in the late 90s? I wonder if today he'd want to add a caveat to that statement, given what this issue gets at.

Winged Victory and her colleagues continue to investigate the matter of former students of her women's shelters/schools being kidnapped and replaced with doppelgangers. It's all part of a smear campaign to discredit her and ruin her reputation.







She's heading for a meeting with the Council of Nike, the secret group whose psychic energies empower her. In light of the recent events that have tarnished her rep, they're no longer sure she should continue as their agent.



She and the Council talk but before any sort of decision can be rendered, she needs to leave because she and the other superheroes have located Karnazon's secret base, and she needs to deal with that first.





And she comes to realize that it's untenable to keep going down this road.



After that's taken care of, it's back to the Council of Nike to resume the discussion.



It's not like the concerns they're raising aren't ones she'd had herself. Still, she's formed her opinions, and she'll stand by them.

Comments

[donnblake]

No, I don't think that, in light of a story focusing on the symbolism that a superheroine represents, Kurt Busiek would feel a need to add a caveat to a statement about the strength of the superhero genre being in its ability to serve as symbolism. Maybe I'm just missing something?

On a related note, did anything happen with the individual (looked like it might turn out to be a transgender woman) who was looking for sanctuary with them?

[icon_uk]

Turns out he was pretty much what he said he was all along, and plays a small, but pivotal, part in locating Karnazon's base.

He is the cause of Winged Victory re-evaluating one of the core messages of her mission, when he becomes the first male to ever be granted sanctuary by her organisation.

[arbre_rieur]

Well, it seems to be saying that you shouldn't take the symbolism thing too far, and if you do, it's not good for the characters.

[donnblake]

I didn't get that at all. I read it as 'When fighting opposition, you shouldn't let your opponents dictate the terms of the argument.' Winged Victory coming out of this is almost certainly still going to be a champion of women and feminism, it's just that she's deciding that that doesn't mean she has to phrase the conflict as men vs women.

Which is actually what prompts the shift, among some feminist theorists, from talking about feminism to talking about anti-patriarchy. (Or, if you're going to broaden the scope and talk about race, class, sexuality, gender identity, etc, kyriarchy). The theory is that it's not a conflict between the genders or sexes (or race, class, etc.,) but a conflict against the system that promulgates oppression based on those differences.

[arbre_rieur]

I think the story's about more than one thing, and that what I'm talking about is at least part of that mix.

"It all turned into symbolic this and symbolic that."
"And we make our symbolic points and who gets hurt?
"Maybe I'd do a better job if I was nothing but a symbol...but I don't know if that's right, either. And I do know I can't do it."

It reads to me as, on some level, an exploration of when the needs of symbolism and the needs of the character/the needs of drama aren't in sync, and how a writer navigates those sometimes conflicting needs. Finally, it comes down on the side of the latter, saying that, yes, maybe doing so does "compromise the message" but regardless it's the only way he *can* write, by treating them as characters first and foremost. And maybe that will earn ire from both sides, both those who are unhappy about the message itself (the news pundits) and those who support it but don't like the unfortunate implications they see in the metaphor and symbolism (the staff who no longer feel safe and leave), but, oh well, you gotta keep trying.

[darth_cloudo]

This looks quite interesting. I'm not familiar with the title or the writer; how does the series stand as a whole?

[crinos]

Astro City is widely considered one of the best super hero comics ever made.

There are some weak points, (I hear some people don't like the dark ages arcs), but on the whole this series is really good. Especially the newest series we are looking at now.

[darth_cloudo]

Wow! Definitely have to check it out then. Thanks :)

*distant sounds of wallet screaming*

[q99]

Yes, it's produced multiple truly, truly great stories. Both one-shots and full arcs.

[coldfury]

Kurt Busiek, to my knowledge, is a pretty well regarded author. He came up with the original concept for the Thunderbolts, wrote a fantastic Avengers run, wrote some great Justice League, and even wrote the superb Avengers/JLA crossover books.

I've never read Astro City, but all I hear are good things.

[darth_cloudo]

Thanks! I've been looking through the tag on S_D and it definitely looks interesting.

[q99]

Yes. He's one of the few writers I trust to consistently make great work, and Astro City is probably his best work.

[kamino_neko]

He gets a bit too meta for my tastes occasionally, but even when he does, that's a minor criticism in among a whole bunch of awesome.

[crinos]

I also like that scene after she flies off from the council of Nike, with that one old lady to the right of the lady she befriended last issue giving her the stink eye as she flew off.

Also: I love the name "Garden Gnome." I am so gonna use that for my own super hero campaign.

[bazor]

I'm imagining he was a brilliant botanist who could create and control plants who wanted to be called the Green God.
Except he was five foot seven, balding, a little dumpy, and had a big beard.
"I am the Green God, Winged Victory!"
"Huh, more like a Garden Gnome"
"..."
*Later on the news*
"Winged Victory defeated the new villain, the Garden Gnome, today.."
And screams of rage rang out from the county lock-up.

[espanolbot]

I'd say that the anti-feminist people in the comic are strawmen, but considering the amount of people I've seen both in real life and online who hold views like that, it just becomes really depressing.

[q99]

Yea.

[thatnickguy]

That's the sad thing. The dialogue from the news anchors could have been lifted right from FOX news verbatim.

[terrykun]

There's a bit of "straw-that-could-be-real" content on both sides. There's also the member of the Council apparently getting in a snit over Winged Victory visibly working with *dun dun dun* men.

[tsunamiwombat]

I feel like that's purposeful on Busiek's part, to show there are misguided voices on both sides, and that real compromise and progress can't happen if the discussion is strictly binary - right v left, right v wrong, women v men. The council of giant floaty spooky heads has it's own reactionary foibles, as do the faux news analysts. W.V. takes the higher ground and doesn't get bogged down in that sort of debate, instead elevating the terms.

Or something. IDK i've never actually read this before.

[tsunamiwombat]

Also I like that she has to specify that Garden Gnome is dead-dead, acknowledging the revolving door o death that is comics