Wolverine #8 - "Games of Deceit and Death, Part One"

[arbre_rieur]

"I'm pleased to be finishing my 25-issue story about Wolverine in the way it was intended, without having to bend it out of shape because my bosses decided to kill him." -- Paul Cornell

Comments

[starwolf_oakley]

I don't mind Shang Chu and Danny Rand being friends. It is just odd, given how "closed off" Shang Chi was from the rest of the Marvel Universe back in the 70s. He was mostly either fighting Fu Manchu or doing missions for MI-6. He only really joined the MU proper for a few guest spots in the 1990s.

[q99]

Once he did get into the rest, it's hard to image him and Danny not getting chummy pretty fast.

[halloweenjack]

I imagine him and Danny occasionally getting together for these epic, hours- or days-long duels that are more like dancing than fighting.

[q99]

Exactly, how could they not?

I mean, even if their personalities didn't mesh- and I'd think they do- how many people can they do that sort of thing with who's not evil?

[espanolbot]

He's shown up now and again in Paul Cornell's work since his Wisdom mini-series. Partly I think because of the MI6 connection, which would technically put him in the resource pool as the other tangentially British superheroes.

[simiansyndicate]

You know, that line...

"...let's finally get Logan killed."

I know the "death of Wolverine" thing is a stunt, and he'll be back, but maybe this time the death is more a metaphorical one. Logan, the loner with but few allegiances and shaky morals will be laid to rest, a ravenous Wolverine no more, replaced with a very different, cautious, and caring James Howlett.

At least, that's what I'm thinking.

[northstarfan]

Possibly, but it seems like more than a little redundant considering how Marvel's pushed the Headmaster Logan thing since Schism.

[thezmage]

It's kinda funny, I mostly remember the question "what does that line the movie mean?" coming from my mother, and I'm the one who has to respond "we don't know yet, we'll find out later."

[kd_the_movie]

Anybody else get the feeling that this supposed to be an Endless!Death expy?

[leoboiko]

Not really, I don't get any of her tenderness.

[burkeonthesly]

I see a fair bit of her matter-of-factness and the wry, teasing tone she takes with people who're being stubborn.

[capnduckman]

I got that hint from the 'english accent' throwaway.

[drtechnobabel]

Strangely enough, I get more of a Deadpool vibe from her, if he had a few thousand years to mellow out and become philosophical. Not sure how accurate that actually is, but it'd at least explain why the two of them are attracted to each other.

Now I'm wondering if Deadpool ever comes here to visit...

[cainofdreaming]

I wouldn't think so. It's Death's place of relaxation, not Death's place of 'relaxation'. Also, the lack of gigantic "Do not disturb" sign at the front door is something of a giveaway.

[drtechnobabel]

I dunno about that... Those guardian ogres could probably be made into a pretty effective 'Do Not Disturb' when needed. After all, the mere existence of a creepy skull shaped temple guarded by monsters delivers one of those universal 'stay the fuck away' messages that doesn't really have any language or cultural barriers.

[thediiem]

I feel like they are channeling the Death that Deadpool seems to have the on-again-off-again relationship with.

Also, this Death completely ignoring Thanos makes a lot of sense.

And how I am thinking of Thanos like a rejected "nice guy".

[espanolbot]

Marvel've kind of lifted bits from the Death of the Endless since Sandman, with her appearing as a little goth child in order to make Thanos uncomfortable or something, for example. Or showing up at... I think that it was Rick Jones' birthday party, I think it was, where she gave him a hair brush as a present (it's a pun).

Here though she reads differently from how Cornell wrote Death when she appeared in his Action Comics run, this version sounds oddly like the Rat King from his recent Peter Quill novel.

[aperturedreams]

Cornell just wrote her in Action Comics a few years back, it probably stuck.

[althechi]

An atrocious reading of the second panel implies Sabertooth was the woman he could've had.

[drtechnobabel]

"Oh Logan, I... I never knew you felt that way! All this time, I thought you could hated me. Everything I've done the past 200 years, all the cruelty and murders... they seem so pointless now! Your love has softened this cold, empty heart. You know what? I'm turning over a new leaf! No longer will I be 'Sabretooth'. From now on, you can call me 'Huggy Kitten'! Let's run away to Fiji together and start a new life as cabaret singers, just you and me Logan! Whaddya say... love?"

"Uh.... I was talking about Pinch."

"...."

"...Creed? You ok?"

"...My God, what have I done? I'll never be taken seriously again... I think I'm going to throw up..."

[crimsonmoonmist]

Oh my, now I see it too!
Once it's been read, it cannot be un-read!

[chrys]

Regarding Cornell's quote: well, I'm glad he got to tell his story without editorial interference but damn, I absolutely hate this story and his Wolverine. This run cannot end soon enough. I'm mildly hopeful we might get an acceptable Logan in the death mini, maybe.

[freezer]

Not a fan of the first few issues, but playing it out where Logan fucking up royally, knowing it, and actually going to others for help seems to be the point... That puts things in a more favorable light.

Not enough to make me like it, mind you. Maybe this will read far better in the trade.

[chrys]

I was talking about Cornell's entire run, this and the previous volume. It's much more than the plot and the execution - I don't like his take on Logan. I don't buy his being crazy scared because he lost his healing factor (happened before), and him and everyone acting like he's a fragile flower now (most heroes don't have healing factors to begin with). And the whole he was immortal before so *never* needed to be courageous was ridiculous (that is said in the next issue) - Logan's healing factor was not so overpowered for years so he dealt with the idea of dying and risking his life many, many times. And then there's the whole going on a journey to have Death tell him everyone fears death... Ugh, I can't with this book. I just read it as a comedy about a fake Logan acting out a mid-life crisis.

[arbre_rieur]

I'd say you've vastly simplifying some pretty complex character work going on in this run. For one thing, he's not "crazy scared." He's someone who still does brave superheroic stuff on a regular basis and, yes, has had one or two moments where his fear knocked him off his game, as I think is perfectly believable for someone who was previously functionally immortal. The other characters are concerned about his safety not because he doesn't have a healing factor but because he's not used to not having one, i.e. not used to having to be so cautious. And nobody says he *never* had to be courageous in the past, just that it was much rarer.

Anyway, as you can probably guess, I'm a big fan of the run. I think the character work's been incredibly nuanced.

[chrys]

Oh, if you think it's pretty complex character work and that it fits Logan and his published past, we'll just have to agree to disagree. Especially since you agree with Cornell that Logan was immortal and I think he just failed to read a lot of comics.

But anyway, the only point I will argue is the courage thing. On #9 it says he had rarely shown courage and that is just not true unless you ignore Logan's past stories. Logan has had many times of true courage and sacrifice and he has faced death many times before.

[arbre_rieur]

When Death says that, she's talking about courage in the specific sense of confronting fear of death, and I do think it's fair to say he's rarely had to face that in comparison to the number of fights and adventures where he hasn't, where he wasn't in danger of dying.

I know Wolverine's healing factor wasn't always this instantaneous regeneration ability that's functionally immortality, the way it's been since the movies, but consider that this is a power escalation that's more real-world than in-universe. Like, whenever we get flashback stories these days, he's depicted with that same instantaneous regeneration. The recent Origin II even has him saying he can't commit suicide. So for better or worse, Marvel's current stance seems to be that his healing has always been this super, that he's always been this unkillable, and those are the cards Cornell was dealt and is playing with.

[chrys]

Sigh. I think I'm gonna hide with my old Wolvie comics and stay there in denial. What they've been doing with Logan (not only Cornell here) doesn't work for me at all. It's a big disconnect from reading 70s-90s comics with him as my favorite mutant and cringing most times I see him in a current comic.

[chrisdv]

...Nope, still hate Iron Fist's white costume.

Why Bendis changed it from green, I don't know.