How Doctor Who Will Actually End

[history79]

Source: http://www.collegehumor.com/

Comments

[althechi]

So if the Daleks had chosen, say, the middle of World War Two to invade the Doctor wouldn't have even begun his spiel?

"Have you seen what they're doing in the concentration camps? Ehh, you can have 'em. I don't care."

[md84]

In Torchwood Children of Earth, Gwen did wonder if humanity's darker deeds were why the Doctor didn't show up more often to help (Children of Earth was a pretty bleak story).

In his own series, he did chew out the Prime Minister when she destroyed a retreating ship of hostile aliens to prevent any future hostilities. The Doctor called it murder, remarked that he should have warned the aliens about the real monsters (the human race), and set in motion events that led to the Prime Minister leaving office.

It seems like the Doctor, as much as he might love humans, isn't blind to humanity's faults and doesn't hesitate to call them out.

[icon_uk]

Though there is a strong POV that the Doctor has no right to judge humanity in that light because he's a meddling visitor. He can make all sorts of decisions because he doesn't have to live on Earth all the time and in sequential order like the rest of us.

And his decision to take revenge and basically depose Harriet Jones because she dared to disagree with the almighty Time Lord's ethical judgement is one that caused a LOT of debate among fans as to whether it was his call to make. (I don't think it was, personally)

The Sycorax had given no indication that they were in any way an honourable or trustworthy race who wouldn't just come back with an armada nad invade again.

[night4345]

The Sycorax had given no indication that they were in any way an honourable or trustworthy race who wouldn't just come back with an armada nad invade again.
They did leave because the Doctor won the duel despite having no reason to not kill him and the rest of the people on board and reactivate the blood control thing besides honor.

[icon_uk]

And the Doctor had just killed (not defeated, but actively killed) the Sycorax Leader because he attempted to kill the Doctor whilst his back was turned... so I don't think anyone wins the Ethical Combat stakes this time around, and I can well believe humans not taking any claim the remaining Sycorax might make to stick to their word as gospel.

IIRC The blood control thing couldn't be re-established because it wasn't nearly as strong as the Sycorax had pretended it was, and once broken, couldn't be reused. Might be wrong there...

[md84]

To the show's credit, it doesn't always portray the Doctor as being right all the time. The Doctor deposing Harriet Jones did eventually backfire in a big way.

And while The Doctor may not have the right to judge humans since he doesn't live on Earth, it's not necessarily a good idea to dismiss the millennia old time traveling alien who is widely feared and respected across space-time just because you don't like what he's saying either. In Doomsday, the head of Torchwood did eventually come around, figuring that maybe she should listen to the guy responsible for Torchwood's existence.

Concerning the Sycorax, regardless of the threat they may or may not have posed in the future, shooting a retreating opponent in the back is still generally considered a bad thing.

[icon_uk]

Oh it's not wise, but when he's being annoyingly cryptic, or intensely patronising, I can see why it would be tempting to.

Torchwood made not a whole lot of sense in a world where UNIT was already established and actually EMPLOYED the Doctor, which should have had 1970's Torchwood up in arms... literally.

[donnblake]

Torchwood's existence still makes sense- UNIT was, as I recall, an international effort (even if it was dominated by British people every time we saw it) whereas Torchwood was explicitly created (retroactively predating UNIT) to protect and forward British interests.

As far as Torchwood not raising a fuss about UNIT employing the doctor, that one's trickier. Probably some combination of Bad Wolf/Clara Oswin Oswald foiling a number of attempts at nefarity over the course of the seventies.

[shadowpsykie]

I think that was the only thing i liked about Kill The Moon, Clara calling CapDoctor on his crap (which this season has gotten pretty bad)

[icon_uk]

Actually, I thought Clara was, for a change, pretty much completely in the wrong there.

Was the Doctor wrong in leaving them to make the choice? Why SHOULD he have to make all the difficult moral choices if there is no obvious "right" one? Why shouldn't he expect a human to make a decision on behalf of humanity for humans.

Wouldn't him making the choice for them have been the patronising thing to do?

[shadowpsykie]

Except I think THE WAY the Doctor did it WAS patronizing (take off the stabilizers) and I think for Clara this was the straw that broke the Camelot back. The Doctor has been pretty condcending lately, I mean I don't mind him being portrayed as weary and grouchy old man. But he's been pretty unlikable lately

[avantre]

Spoiler alert for some people:

One of the very recent episodes with the current Doctor actually had him step back and force his companion (and some others) to decide what to do between killing a creature or letting it live and possibly causing huge destruction to Earth, because it was a decision that was up to them as humans since it was their planet in possible danger. The companion was really furious at him for not meddling.

[crinos]

Yeah, and that totally pissed me off that the Doctor did that.

The Sycorax were a race of cowardly, murderous assholes who tried to blackmail humanity into becoming its slaves, murdered several people for the lulz, and when the Doctor won Earth's freedom by beating their leader in sword fighting, his response was to charge him from behind.

There was no reason to believe the Sycoracx would honor the bargain the made with the Doctor. no Guarantee that, once the Doctor (Who does not live on Earth, and only visits would we would consider modern day earth once in a while, usually to either pick up a new companion, drop a companion off, or let a companion have some down time,) left, the Sycorax would just turn around and attack Earth with everything they had.

And nevermind the fact that the direct result of the Doctor deposing the, in his word, "Architect of Britain's golden age?" Well, a little guy called Harold Saxxon became the PM. AKA the Master, AKA the guy who conquered earth with an army of indestructible death balls, sank japan, kept the Doctor as his pet for a year, and generally made everyone's life a living hell. Great move there shitlord.

And that's forgiving that like, the very next season The Doctor genocided the entire Raknoss race to keep them from devouring humanity, but oh I guess its okay when the Doctor does it.

You know, Ten really is my favorite Doctor, but man this was his lowest point for me. He comes off as a petty, judgemental asshole who was upset because someone besides him got the final word on the alien invaders.

[donnblake]

Well, the Master became PM because he ruthlessly used his Time Lord knowledge to accomplish nationwide low level brainwashing, and insane murder cyborgs (no, not those ones, some new insane murder cyborgs) to kill anyone who got in his way. I'm not sure Harriet Jones being there or elsewhere had anything to do with it.

[crinos]

IIRC it actually said that Harold Saxxon rose to prominence following "The fall of Harriet Jones", so mind control or not, the lack of Harriet Jones gave The Master the opening he needed.

Also of note, Harriet Jones actually commissioned a secret communications network of all the Doctors friends in case the world was ever in danger and he was indisposed (Like when the Daleks stole Earth for their big "kill the entire multiverse" machine), and the others even called her out on the fact that she did this in spite of the fact the Doctor ruined her. Plus she even died defending it from the Daleks.

So say what you want, Harriet Jones was a stand up lady, and deserved more than to have her career ruined by the Doctor's little temper tantrum.

[cainofdreaming]

Given the Master's resources, how could she have stopped him from gaining power even if she was still the prime minister?

And about deserving it... she'd just taken the lives of who knows how many beings that were no immediate threat. What's a single career compared to that? If a cop does that to a single individual he or she loses their career, if not more, why should a politician be any different?

Would she really have been able to keep her career if what she did was made public?

[icon_uk]

I'd say there's worse press to have than "British PM orders destruction of cowardly alien invaders who threatened entire planet and murdered cold-bloodedly!"

[cainofdreaming]

After they'd stopped being a threat. Do you really think the opposing parties would let that past them?

[icon_uk]

Without wishing to demean a real wartime tragedy by comparison, Margaret Thatcher and the "General Belgrano" scenario springs to mind. The other parties tried to use it against her more than once, but it never worked.

[cainofdreaming]

I do not really know the specifics, but weren't the those, the specifics again, of the sinking kept somewhat under lock and key? Thatcher's government even trying to prosecute the man under Official Secrets Act when a whistleblower published them three years later. And politics makes peoples memories short.

Just parroting wiki, really. Kinda before I became aware of the wider world outside of kindergarten.

[icon_uk]

Thanks for making me feel old again you young whippersnapper! :P

It was never a secret that it was sunk outside the previously stated Exclusion Zone, and that would have been impossible to cover up since it happened in the open seas and the wreck would easily have been found.

The fact it was sailing away wasn't known until later, and certainly didn't help matters, but even then, Thatcher kept going for another 8 years and her downfall wasn't linked to the event.

[crinos]

Oh, you mean like the time the Daleks invaded during World War 2. And were actually working (or pretending) to work under Winston Churchill as his new secret weapon against the Nazis?

Or that time when the Daleks actually teamed up with some Neo Nazi's to try and their hands on some ancient Timelord thingy the Doctor hid on Earth?

[steverodgers5]

Well he does have a bit of a british bias..LOL!

Awww...

[steverodgers5]

Poor Doctor Eleven. He always was wanting to think the best of folks. Don't think he'd give that speech now LOL!

Re: Awww...

[icon_uk]

I think Twelve would... he seems to quite like humanity but, like Six, he finds humans a bit of a strain.

Re: Awww...

[espanolbot]

To be fair, a lot of us are.

Re: Awww...

[steverodgers5]

Yeah, he does come off as a bit conflicted. But I supppose he is a lot older now, so I guess maybe his cynicism has grown a bit..