Mark Millar vs Twilight

[history79]

from Ultimate Avengers 3 #4

Comments

[captainbellman]

Well, that was subtle. And the "Ugly Betty" reference really makes it timeless.

[norj]

I can see Blade travelling to the twilight universe just so he could murder everybody.

[janegray]

Gotta be honest, the Twilight bashing is starting to annoy me.

Yes, it's a terrible story. Yes, they are terrible characters. Yes, it romanticizes abuse.

But the thing is, there are TONS of terrible stories with terrible characters that romanticize abuse, and none of them get even a fraction of the scorn Twilight does. I'm starting to think that it's because Twilight is aimed at a female audience so it's more acceptable to hate and mock :/

[halloweenjack]

Yep, pretty much this. I have to admit that I was amused at the fan art of the Count from Sesame Street clocking Edward was funny, but mostly because just about any muppet punching someone out is funny. Vampirism in general is a male power/rape fantasy anyway, usually.

[drtechnobabel]

I disagree. I think it has more to do with the fact that despite all of that, it still managed to become insanely popular with a genuine fan-base, while much better works were left in the shadows of obscurity.

I do agree that the bashing is starting to get old, if only because the same jokes told repeatedly get boring after a while.

[walkingthroughforest]

You realize this comic came out in 2010, right?

[angelophile]

Yep. Twilight gets the level of scorn that only things beloved by teenage girls get. The Transformers movies are horrific on as many levels (if different ones) and similarly popular with teenage boys, but they don't get the same level of ridicule and disgust the Twilight does. Don't try and tell me that there's not a strong undertone of sexism and ageism involved.

[cyberghostface]

I'm starting to think that it's because Twilight is aimed at a female audience so it's more acceptable to hate and mock :/

I don't think that's the case. Twilight was a huge phenomenon and a lot of it was just susceptable for that type of reaction. Lots of girls were tearing it apart as well so it's not even a case of just guys targeting it.

[ozaline]

I think you're partly right, same reason 50 shades gets so much hate. Anita Sarkeesian did a video on the "wrong," and "right," reasons to hate Twilight, and that showcased there is some misdirected anger at "sissyfying," the vampire.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQwqepW97zs

But I think a huge part of it is it's visibility and that allows for useful discussion, the same discussion can be had about Anakin in Star Wars (and has been made), but at least for as clumsy as that was their relationship was never shown as healthy (even in the Clone Wars series).

[leoboiko]

There are shades of effeminacy-hatred, too (as if the problem with Edward is him being a "pasty, little pretty-boy" – or, notoriously, sparkling).

[ebailey140]

Yeah, there are a lot of bad stories out there. However, Twilight stand out, because...

1. It ruined vampires. Now, we're stuck with zombies, zombies, zombies, and I'm burned out on them.

Here's a parody video from a few years back where Edward meets a certain vampire slayer, with a little Harry Potter thrown in. Go ahead and call this "sexist"...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZwM3GvaTRM

Which brings us to...

2. Girls are taught by this and a certain other series that got its start as a Twilight fanfic to see Edward Cullen & Christian Grey as the Ideal Man. When they find one of those... Hope they come out of the abusive relationship OK, assuming they survive it. The difference between these and other books supporting abuse is, yes, being directed at a female audience. Therefore, those other stories aren't the ones convincing girls to actively seek out abusive relationships.

Here's another parody, featuring the comics version of the Edward/Bella relationship. The parallels fit. And neither we nor the writers romanticize it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGd9qAfpZio

3. The fan base. Rabid Twilight fans are only rivaled by rabid Avatar fans (the Cameron movie, not the cartoon) in their ability to invite scorn and abuse. Take this Twihard, for example. Stephen King was asked his opinion of Harry Potter nad Twilight. He liked HP, didn't like Twilight, and explained why. So, according to Twihards, he ws just jealous that he never had any big selling books or big movies made from them. No, really. Oh, strong language...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDQ2h4hrors

Hmm, just with movies alone... Carrie? The Shining? Misery? The Shawshank Redemption? And do you really want to compare book sales? Then, there's the Twihard claim that J. K. Rowling totally ripped Twilight off with the character Sirius Black, never mind that the book that introduced Sirius was published in 1999 while the first Twilight book was published in 2005. Who ripped off whom? That was topped, though, when Universal put out its remake of The Wolf Man (the original classic being from 1941), and Twihards accused IT of being a Twilight ripoff.

C'mon, how can you NOT make fun? When the first Twilight movie came out, Twihards declared war on Harry Potter and its fandom, which had a LOT of fun smacking them down.

4. Really, really, bad writing. The movies had a talented cast and crew, but they just couldn't overcome the source material. For example, how Sparklevamp was able to father a child even though he wasn't producing sperm... He was SO PURE, that he not only never masturbated in all those decades, he never even had a wet dream! So, the sperm he had when he was turned was STILL THERE!

If you have the iron will to not make fun of that, I admire you. But, you need to understand that not everyone can resist.

[skemono]

I'm starting to think that it's because Twilight is aimed at a female audience so it's more acceptable to hate and mock :/

Undoubtedly.

[beyondthefringe]

Oh, Millar.
Never change.

[walkingthroughforest]

Bahaha that was amazing. Fuck yes, Millar.

[alicemacher]

I'll grant that most of the jokes are old by now, but "Intensely?" made me giggle though I don't know why.

As for Twilight-bashing being sexist, I think cyberghostface and drtechnobabel address that well enough; I would add that the sexism is to be found in Twilight itself. Its message is basically, "Girls who are smart [even if it's "informed smartness"] and popular should toss everything away for a pretty-looking man even if he's a stalkery creep and should be willing to seriously injure themselves for him."

[ablackraptor]

Well, in fairness, a lot of the more vocal hate doesn't tend to focus on the creepiness of the skeevy sexist parts of the book; like, the parody above doesn't address anything besides the age difference, and even that is framed in a 'someone as old as me should be interested in a more interesting person' type thing, and the same goes for a lot of general audiences.

[beoweasel]

You know, it's rather ironic for Millar to bash other people's masturbation fantasies given the kind of stuff that he writes. I mean shit, isn't Wanted an ode to the violent fantasies of angry white boys everywhere?

The other thing that bothers me about the many, MANY parodies of Twilight isn't just their unoriginality, but they seem set on mocking the obvious and ignoring the really problematic elements of the Twilight series.

Like, they make fun of Edward being a pasty-white pretty boy and little more than a character meant to appeal to the fantasies of young girls...buuut, they ignore that he's manipulative, controlling, and a fucking stalker. And shit, let's not even get into the whole creepy 'pro-life' message that's pushed heavily in the third book, or that a grown man imprints on a goddamn BABY, which means they're destined for twue wuv later...though, the child's agency is completely ignored.

[cyberghostface]

I really don't see Wanted being Millar's fantasy given how despicable the leads are. Maybe something like Kick-Ass which Millar has admitted to being based off how he was as a kid.

[alicemacher]

Good points.

For some people, the reason mockery of the franchise tends to go for the obvious and superficial aspects is that the deeper, more disturbing elements you mention simply don't occur to them unless someone points them out. For others, it may be that even when the misogynistic, anti-choice and other harmful implications are pointed out, they don't care (though they most definitely should).

But I suspect there are still others who avoid tackling the more problematic elements in Twilight simply because topics such as stalking and psychological/emotional abuse are extremely hard to satirize without the satire itself being offensive.

Take, for example, Amanda "Shinga" Bussell's webcomic Head Trip, source of some of the best-known Twilight mockery online. The first stab at the series sticks to the obvious "Mary Sue" and "dull pretty boy" jokes (which were fresh back in 2008). Bussell's second take on Twilight, though spot-on accurate, is rather less funny, even as dark comedy, because...well, see for yourself (trigger warning for verbal references to sexual assault and brutal violence). Then again, given Malory's silent, stunned reaction, it may be that strip isn't supposed to make us laugh, but to make us righteously angry. I don't know.

Looks like Blade enjoys taking enthusiastic walks, too!

[7dialsmystery]

knock knock knock knock

Who's there?

A real f--king vampire!

blam blam blam blam blam blam !!!

Re: Looks like Blade enjoys taking enthusiastic walks, too!

[sindra]

*cough*

BITCHES LOVE CANNONS

*ahem*

[starwolf_oakley]

Tweaked a little, Twilight could be a look at Toxic Masculinity through the prism of a YA vampire story. Edward doesn't *want* to be a controlling stalker, but all his urges tell him to. James and Riley are toxic masculinity run rampant, although they are both under Victoria's thumb. Edward and Co. even try reasoning with Riley about how Victoria is manipulating him, IIRC.

[sindra]

I almost made a comic strip exactly like this one time.....but replace Blade with Simon Belmont.

Equally as hilarious.

[q99]

I do have to admit, if there's *one* character who'd be against the romanticization of vampires....

[sagrada]

And well he should. Can you imagine it?

Blade, forced to confront that which he hunts and hates made as beautiful as his dreams dared to venture.

His suppressed desire for a loving light in those corpse's eyes, a gleam of affection from those hookéd fangs. The touch of that supple, silk-wrapped icy skin with its taut and lethal muscles. Ah, to press that unthrobbing chest to his own...!

But no. Stakey-time calls, and calls in the tongue of VENGEANCE.