DC vs. Vampires #2 and #3

[history79]

#2







#3

Comments

[lordultimus]

Man, DC can't decide whether Diana's immune to mind control or not.

Vampire Zatanna's hot, though.

[jlbarnett]

she's immune to certain types

[jgraygaming]

Have we confirmed if these vampires are immune to holy objects yet? Because it seems to me the lasso qualifies.

[thediiem]

Plus the lasso is literally made of fire. I feel like it's burned people in the past?

[donnblake]

Vampires and Holy Symbols are another one of those things were that can be played enough ways that it's worth explicitly establishing your rules for them if you're going to use it.

Like- is it dependent upon the faith of the person presenting the symbol (Dracula's appearance in X-men, Dresden Files)? Is it dependent upon the vampire's belief that the symbol ought to be effective (Discworld)? Is it a neurological quirk of a quasi-scientific vampirism (Blindsight, that Scott Westerfeld series)? If it's power actively being channelled by a divine entity, how divine counts as divine- "god" in the DC Universe covers a lot of ground. Does the god in question actively have to have a beef with vampires or they allergic to whatever we've defined divinity as in general?

[skinrash]

Dracula's an established character in the DC universe. Wonder if he's gonna show up in this.

[jaxjyls]

All the Superheroes are going to die or be turned so that Batman gets to be the great saviour, aren't they

[deh_tommy]

Batman already had his turn as a vampire back in Red Rain and he was killed off very quickly in DCeased, he’s overdue for being the big hero saving the world.

[jaxjyls]

God forbid Bruce from having all the limelight for once

[zechs80]

Ollie is also doing his own thing with the Arrow family. He's going more under the radar from the vampires compared to Bruce. I get the feeling Bruce and the Bat-Family (save Damian since Dinah and him made contact this issue) will die.

The vampires know that Batman and the Bat-Family are looking into them. Hence what the vampires do at the end of #3.

[deh_tommy]

Okay, so like, on the one hand this really scratches my hypnokink, so yay for me.

On the other… I hate that I’ve become so nitpicky. How can Hal still use his Lantern ring now that his will is not his own? Why did Wonder Woman not take any precautions against vampiric hypnosis, like not looking him in the eyes? Does blessing stuff only work if that’s Christian? Because Wonder Woman herself has either been blessed directly by several gods or is a literal demigod, her blood would probably be, like, poisonous as heck. Plus, she’s decked out in silver here (or at least material that looks like silver), wouldn’t that give Hal pause? Why didn’t she take the ring off? Can she still use the lasso after turning into a vampire given their entire sthick is deceit? Would the lasso not technically be a holy relic? Can she ever get to the Amazons given their island is probably consecrated to Olympus and back?

[stubbleupdate]

And how does it relate to the whole "amazons submitting to men" thing?

Is hypnosis and vampiric conversion a form of submission?

[lego_joker]

As much as I love the character, I understand this is the main reason Wonder Woman is an absolute nightmare for most writers, especially if you're gonna toss her into a shared-universe story like this. Her backstory, her supporting cast - even her powerset has an insane number of moving parts, which virtually no two writers have ever agreed on.

(Hell, "Greek Mythology was real all along, and for better or worse the Gods continue to meddle in modern mortal life" itself raises hundreds, probably thousands of questions and premises that would completely derail any straightforward story if you paid even 10% attention to them.)

[tinygaylaura]

"Okay, so like, on the one hand this really scratches my hypnokink, so yay for me."

It being Hal Jordan kills my lady-boner tho

I just can't get wet about anything to do with Mr Amber Alert Lantern Corps here doing anything

Zatanna as a vampire tho, that is pretty damn hot

But they send her after the Penguin?

All the hot women in basically fetish gear she could be going after in the DCU and she's after Oswald?

Wasted oppurtunity

[scorntx]

... given Penguin's usually supposed to be a classy sort of fella, would he really count as junk food?
All that high class wining and dining, he'd probably taste a little rich, if fishy.
Surely if Zatanna wanted junk food, henchmen would be the better choice.
(... then again, in Gotham... drinking a Gotham citizen's blood is probably like the late night suspicious kebab of blood-drinking.
You don't know what's in there, and that's probably a good thing, but you're still going to regret it come the day after.)

[didiji]

If vampires are a trend again nowadays (are they?), DC really missed an opportunity to make a good story of it. They made Hal so very overpowered here killing other heroes I can't stop rolling my eyes when I see him.

[mastermahan]

It's not just that Vamp Hal is an invincible villain who can effortlessly defeat A-list heroes with a look.

It's not just that Mr. Willpower himself is apparently completely helpless to resist vampiric control without the slightest sign of a struggle.

It's that Hal Jordan as a clever, manipulative schemer is just so far out of character it might as well not be him. Hal is headstrong and doesn't really plan ahead. He is, frequently, a bit of a dumbass. If you want to write about evil Hal, give us evil Hal, not this stranger with his name.

[leahandillyana]

I thought it would be interesting if this Hal was no Hal at all but somebody else impersonating him, but that would be too complex for the good of the story.

[mastermahan]

I actually thought about this, given how far out of character Hal is here. Like how in early Buffy, vampires weren't transformed humans, but demon replacements. At least until the show just started ignoring that.

[mazway_75]

I lean toward a different universe so maybe this Hal not so laid back and such. Yet the thing about Hal is....well, he's John Crichton from Farscape, he may seem an idiot and yeah, a lot of the time is, but there's a method to his madness that works.

Sinestro even said that's the reason he could never beat Hal "put a schemer or plotter in front of me and I grind them into dust. But you....your actions never make sense yet somehow always work."

Still issues left to go but can see the idea that vampirism does change folks (Marvel has played on that too) so I can accept Hal changing. And would be fun if when finally found out, he goes "I was never the fool you thought, I just let the ego take over. Now that's not a problem."

[leahandillyana]

I honestly do not enjoy at all the assumption that vampirism changes your personality to the point you will drop your core beliefs. Villains turned into vampires? Sure, why not, they were already doing the same, now with exta fire power. A hero betraying their comrades after becoming a vampire? Interesting premise, though making HAL of all characters into a card carrying villain stretches the suspension of disbelief to the point a tragic scene from the second issue was unintentionally hilarious. Most of this issue? No thanks. There's no moral dilemma in it. It reads like a writer's "my brain went on holidays" story.

[donnblake]

Yeah, you can do "being a vampire leaves you as the same person with effectively a blood addiction," and play that out into a gradual downward spiral (merged with, if you're doing long-term telling, a tendency to distance oneself from humans as immortality ticks on).

Or you can do "The vampire is effectively a new, evil, entity, though it may retain the memories of the person it came from."

But if you're looking for something more complex then that, it really helps if you have a solid idea of the metaphysics mapped out ahead of time, and I don't really see that here.

[deh_tommy]

Basically, if you want a better DC vs. vampires story, go read the Red Rain stuff or watch The Batman vs. Dracula

[deh_tommy]

I don’t mind that angle too much. That’s how a lot of vampire stories have worked before as far back as the original Dracula, they’re essentially twisted copies of the original using said original’s corpse, slaves to the one who turned them. That can be some truly scary stuff.

I don’t think this book is bad, but there’s a lot of little things that bug me (namely the convenience and ease the vampires have in turning the supers) and that always annoys me when things arbitrarily happen because the plot demands it.

[tinygaylaura]

Okay look I just can't believe that in this situation if Hal was acting sus they wouldn't just stake him on the grounds that even if he's not a vampire they aren't going to lose anything of value