Human Torch and Toro take matters into their own hands...

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

(second Hitler post in one day)



Is it just me or is that alot for a guy on fire to say all at once ?



Recently there was some debate on weather or not the first Human torch killed Hitler. I had insisted that he did and it was confirmed in both the FF and All winners squad. However I was wrong. The scene is only referenced in this What if ? issue. I dunno who it was that said so, but you were right. :)

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I've heard Hammond killing the Torch referenced many times and it was shown in the Saga of the Original Human Torch limited series, written by Roy Thomas, as well as first depicted in an old Golden Age story (Young Men #24).

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

Interesting.

[psychop_rex.insanejournal.com]

I can back that up, as I have a reprint of that story in front of me. Here are Hitler's dying words:

"OWW! The Human Torch has set me afire! But don't let the world know how I died! Tell them I committed suicide! ARGGG!"

Moreover, if you take a look at the letter page (as yet unfilled by letters) of the issue of 'What if?' if question, you will note that they acknowledge that THIS issue of 'What if?' is actually set in the normal MU, as a supplement to the then-current 'Invaders' series. It's in 'What if?' because of the somewhat shaky reasoning that (and I quote) "in the Invaders title itself, the year 1946 will doubtless NEVER HAPPEN!" (Meaning, I suppose, that since the Invaders is intrinsically a WW2 book, a story set AFTER WW2 can't really be considered a part of the series.) Also, to be more succinct, "because it wouldn't fit anywhere else!" So, while it IS in a 'What if?', it's still perfectly in line with regular continuity.

[(Anonymous)]

If I'm not mistaken there were a couple of other stories in What If? that were also 616 cannon. The story of the All-Winner's Squad saving the life of a young JFK (in which the first replacement Captain America dies) and the What If there were a 1950's Avengers story, what was later made cannon in Agents of Atlas, which acknowledged those events as having happened.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

That's This story. Prof. Hammond creates "Adam II" and he tries to take over the world. Somehow the Android, senses that JFK ( who is at this time running for Congress) will become president and tries to kill him. CAP dies saving him and The Patriot takes over at the new Captain America at the end. :)

[(Anonymous)]

Oh so that's where this is from, I maybe should have realized that. Whatever happened to Adam II? Did he ever make another appearance? He and Ultron have a lot in common. Neat story. I've only read the recap of it in the Saga of the Original Human Torch mini.

http://www.comics.org/covers.lasso?SeriesID=4048

Note that third cover, which shows Hitler about to get himself toasted.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

There was a Captain America annual where a few alternate Caps get together in a crossover and overthrow an Earth where AdamII took over. Does this ring a bell with anyone ????

[espanolbot.insanejournal.com]

The Unknown Soldier killed Hitler too. :) I don't have scans unfortunately, but it involved a vampire octopus apparently.

[bluefall.insanejournal.com]

Well, you can't kill Hitler too many times, really.

[cmdr_zoom.insanejournal.com]

Don't make me link to TV Tropes.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

Yeah, we're talking about Marvel 616 :)

[darkblade.insanejournal.com]

This means Bucky!Cap lied to us about his Hitlericide. Oh Noes!

[jmacq1.insanejournal.com]

Maybe, or maybe not.

Bucky was arguing that killing Osborn might not make a difference in the long run, or might not have the desired outcome, basically. Someone brought up the "If you could go back in time and kill Hitler wouldn't you do it?" scenario, and Bucky replied with, "Uh...I did kill Hitler."

Given all the wackiness going on in the Marvel U at the time, it's entirely possible Bucky killed either a clone Hitler thinking it was the original, or he killed the original Hitler but Adolph and Zola already had "contingency clones" waiting in the wings, (or perhaps Hitler was resurrected somehow) so the war went on in either case.

The only other option I could think of us that Bucky killed a Hitler-clone as the Winter Soldier but thought that it was the original.

Of course, it's all just rampant speculation on my part but it'd certainly explain Bucky's point of view. "Yeah, I killed Hitler and the war didn't stop...I don't think killing Osborn is going to make things better for us in and of itself."

[jkcarrier.insanejournal.com]

I haven't seen it myself, but I have heard that the short-lived Human Torch series from the 1950s was where it was first established that he killed Hitler.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

I will investigate further.

[alschroeder.insanejournal.com]

Exactly. It was a single scene in the story that brought the Human Torch back in the early fifties. The "Lying till his last breath" dialogue was taken directly from the one panel.

[halloweenjack.insanejournal.com]

How'd Hammond know that the button was flameproof?

Re:

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

secondary power ?

Re:

[daningram.insanejournal.com]

He was just looking for the easiest excuse to burn Hitler to death. Hard to blame him.

Re:

[dr_hermes.insanejournal.com]

The Comics Code. Roy Thomas had to include that so as to not give the Torch a way to capture Hitler without killing him. Hard to believe there was a time when heroes killing was almost completely taboo even in war and Western comics.

[zordboy.insanejournal.com]

"Is it just me or is that alot for a guy on fire to say all at once?"

It's comics. *shrug*

I have a JLA annual where Flash falls off a skyscraper, and has time -- while falling -- to have an entire page of conversation with Kyle, who's still at the top of the building.

Yeah.

[crinosg.insanejournal.com]

Am I the only one who saw this and first thought "DAYUM, Uatu has been hitting the gym. Does he have Drax the Destroyer as a personal trainer or something? I mean come on!"

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

I have always found it amusing that editorially there has never been an attempt to reign in the look of Uatu the watcher. Everyone just felt free to have a go .

[crinosg.insanejournal.com]

Really. I did not know that.

Maybe it was meant intentionally; so that you get a sense that everyone see's him a little differently.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

Do a google image search. It's all over the map.

[freivolk.insanejournal.com]

Are we getting Hitler-week?

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

It's Hitler week if you want it to be .

[freivolk.insanejournal.com]

Like they say: Everybody can be Hitler for 15 minutes today.

[jlroberson.insanejournal.com]

The art is who, Frank Robbins? I remember when I was a kid being simultaneously put off by his apparent sloppiness, then drawn in by the sheer energy and wildness of it.

[qob.insanejournal.com]

Yea, I hate this art with the passion of a supernova

[golden_orange.insanejournal.com]

I love how Hitler would rather be remembered for committing suicide rather than being roasted alive in a final act of defiance; as if being burned alive by the Human Torch is such a stupendously embarrassing way of dying that the only other tolerable option is claiming suicide.

[volksjager.insanejournal.com]

It is funny how people look at things sometimes.

[(Anonymous)]

What's funny/ironic is that in real life, the Nazi government (what small bit was left of it after he killed himself) put out a press release over the radio claiming that Hitler had fallen bravely in battle.