icon_uk: (Default)
[personal profile] icon_uk posting in [community profile] scans_daily
"Avatar: The Last Airbender" and it's sequel "The Legend of Korra" featured some of the best worldbuilding of any cartoon series I've ever seen. The various societies were rich, and complex, and they included their resident elemental powers with creativity and practicality.



One area the cartoon did not expand on was how certain social matters were addressed, and the Korra finale, which showed Korra joining hands with Asami Sato, the woman she loves, as they step into the Spirit World, was positively subversive in showing a blossoming same sex relationship.

So it's good news that Turf Wats, the graphic novel continuation of the series, and which is written by Michael Dante DiMartino (one of the series co-creators), with line art by Irene Koh and colouring by Jane Bak and Vivian Ng, and which is considered canon with the cartoon (the series other creator Bryan Konietzko, is a consultant on the series), is addressing this;

So Korra and Asami have returned from the Spirit World and are ealing with matters arising from the the end of the series, during which the meet up with Kya, the daughter Aang and Katara, who reveals a bit more about her own life than we already knew.

tumblr_ou94tdMLYk1vzbjgio1_1280.jpg

tumblr_ou94tdMLYk1vzbjgio2_1280.jpg

tumblr_ou94tdMLYk1vzbjgio3_1280.jpg

tumblr_ou94tdMLYk1vzbjgio4_1280.jpg

So in four short pages, we have Kya outing herself to our lesbian bizexual heroes, discussion of the Air Nomad, Water Tribe and Fire Nation attitude towards differing orientations, and the reveal that Kyoshi, a previous Avatar, was most likley bisexual. Now that's concsise storytelling!

Date: 2017-08-19 09:49 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
It's kind of odd that there are people complaining (or at least grumbling) about Sozin outlawing same-sex couples.
The guy started a war, attempted genocide, made hunting dragons a sport, which nearly led to their extinction, even when he had a dragon himself, corrupted the very thing his entire nation was founded on, and left his best friend to die...
But making the lives of his citizens worse is just beyond comprehension, apparently.
(Even though it does make a sort of horrific sense - if they're not allowed to love who they want, they get angry, which given the Fire Nation warped firebending to be based on anger and rage...)

... noting Kya never specifies what the Fire Lords after Sozin said, though.

Also, it's nice for Kya to get some focus. For all she was there, we didn't get much of a look into her past.
(Yeah, okay, tertiary character, but still.)

So Kyoshi: Punched out a shark-squid, founded her own state just as a "piss the hell off" gesture, was a mother of at least one child, and lived to over two hundred.
And yet she doesn't get her own series?! Where's the justice?
(And she's awesome. But that's redundant.)

Oh, by the by, when it says "graphic novel" continuation, that mean it's an actual graphic novel, or is it in comic form (and they're just calling it a graphic novel)?

Date: 2017-08-19 10:49 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] long_silence
I wouldn't say "attempted genocide". Sozin was successful. Almost every single airbender died, either in the initial campaign or in the subsequent traps he set to capture anyone who escaped.

An entire culture just died, disappeared from living memory. Everything after was based on the sketchy memories of a hyperactive twelve year old, and best guesses based on what he could find and read over a hundred years after the fact.

Date: 2017-08-21 07:51 pm (UTC)
full_metal_ox: (Default)
From: [personal profile] full_metal_ox
I imagine Aang having had to commune with Avatar Yangchen to learn about the women's side of things: a monastery wouldn't have afforded much opportunity to witness stuff like birthing and menarcheal customs.
.

Date: 2017-08-20 01:33 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] locuatico
I recall a critical piece about a movie about the custody of a mixed-race child between their racist white grandfather and their african-american family.
IIRC, The criticism was: The movie explores where the grandfather's racism comes from, why would he hate black people so much in a way that acts like he is ultimately someone you should feel sorry for. the black family is simply shown as dysfunctional.

Is something you can see media doing a lot. white people get to have a novel lenght backstory explaining why they are racist. that there is a motivation behind their racism. But black people are poor for no good reason.
This is very concerning because it often shows white people a mistaken representation of what racism actually is. Because when they are shown accurate depictions of racism (not to say the other racism never happens, just that racism at large isn't propagated because of that) they fail to recognize it as such. "why would this character be racist? they don't have any reason to be. this is poorly written)

I think the same logic could be applied to homophobes and homophobia. people are claiming Ozai being an homophobe makes no sense because they are so used to homophobes in media there is a reason why they are like that.
Also, they refuse to pick even one history book about homophobia.

Date: 2017-08-20 12:11 am (UTC)
every_spiegel: (Default)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
Everyone's posting only these pages so I have to ask: there's a story too, is there? I mean, that is the comics with some adventures and stuff and Korrasami/same-sex-relationships discussion/reaction, yes, not just the latter?

Date: 2017-08-20 02:26 am (UTC)
trooper924: (Default)
From: [personal profile] trooper924
Could we get some scans of that? It sounds interesting.

Date: 2017-08-20 12:00 pm (UTC)
every_spiegel: (Default)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
Sounds good! Thank you.

Date: 2017-08-20 07:30 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] long_silence
The most interesting part I found was revisiting the physical affects of humans being possessed by Spirits.

Korra has been so set on humans and spirits living in peaceful coexistence. But between humans claiming to own the land where the spirit wilds and portal are and the spirits having the power to permanently alter a human's body like that, the conflict is so much more complicated and potentially interesting. I almost wish that this was the direction they had chosen to go with in the show instead of Kuvira or the Red Lotus.

Date: 2017-08-21 03:29 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] matrix_dragon
Well, any direction would have been better and more interesting than the Red Lotus, really.

But more importantly, it would have been fascinating because of one simple fact the show demonstrated time and time again. Spirits are jackasses that need to be punched in the teeth. Repeatedly. Their clashes with humanity could be utterly fascinating. And it would increase the odds of a certain owl getting plucked, so there's a plus.

Date: 2017-08-21 08:03 pm (UTC)
full_metal_ox: (Default)
From: [personal profile] full_metal_ox
You might be interested in this fanfic portraying a happier ending for Professor Zei:

https://www.fanfiction.net/s/3052595/1/For-the-Sake-of-Knowledge

Date: 2017-08-20 03:13 am (UTC)
jeyl: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jeyl
Does it really matter? Our characters are developing, learning more about the world they inhabit and are making life choices that will no doubt affect where this comic goes. For a lot of fans, Korra and Asami's story is the only one that matters. If they are not enough to grab your interest, this may not be the comic for you.

Date: 2017-08-20 12:04 pm (UTC)
every_spiegel: (LOVE)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
I'm not from that lot, because I think that story matters too. I'm all for Korra and Asami being together and accepted but it's great that the adventures continue too %)
My question was of genuine curiosity, not of sarcasm or anything like that.

Date: 2017-08-21 05:05 am (UTC)
jeyl: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jeyl
I'm sorry, but I'm having a difficult time believing that you asked this question out of 'genuine curiosity'. Where's the logic in coming to a social website asking it's users if a comic has a story? Would it make any sense if I joined a book club just to ask if an upcoming novel will feature any words?

What is wrong with figuring this question out by reading the story description wherever this book is sold?

Date: 2017-08-21 02:15 pm (UTC)
every_spiegel: (max)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
You are free to have this difficult time as long as you deem reasonable.
I asked 'cause I wanted to know whether this is a small ship-centric one-shot or a long story, and I asked it in the post dedicated to this particular title. And a member of the community answered me and described it a bit. Voluntarily and without seeing a problem.
And then came you.
Ah.

Date: 2017-08-21 11:15 pm (UTC)
jeyl: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jeyl
When there are so few works out there that deal with social matters like this in mainstream big houses like nickelodeon, is it really a good idea to come into a discussion about those very matters and ask "there's a story too, is there?" It's like you're annoyed that Korra and Asami's relationship is getting a lot of attention even though that's pretty much the whole point to this comic. It's right there in the description.

"In order to get through it all, Korra and Asami vow to look out for each other– but first, they've got to get better at being a team and a couple!"

If you're only in this for the B-Plot, you're in it for the wrong reasons. The Avatar franchise excels when it comes to it's A-Plot, and it's A-Plot is always about it's characters.

Date: 2017-08-22 12:11 am (UTC)
every_spiegel: (DOOM)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
I suggest you stop fantasizing about my motives and feelings long after I stated them clearly. And stop talking to me at all, if you'd be so kind.

Date: 2017-08-20 09:12 pm (UTC)
mastiff: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mastiff
Of course it matters. People have different reasons for enjoying stories. If Korra and Asami's story "is the only one that matters" then so be it, but it doesn't seem unreasonable to enjoy other aspects of this world and ask what else is going on.

Date: 2017-08-21 04:38 am (UTC)
jeyl: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jeyl
Of course it's not unreasonable to ask if there's a story. I just think it's a silly question given the context of what this post was trying to cover. Since scans_daily's has a pretty restrictive page limit, it should go without saying that what is covered here ISN'T the full story.

Also, aren't there other places one can go to figure out if this comic has a story? Like ANY website that describes the comic in question?

Date: 2017-08-21 04:57 pm (UTC)
mastiff: (Default)
From: [personal profile] mastiff
And yet, icon_uk managed to answer the question in two sentences, and the world did not come to a crashing end.

Yes, we can find the answers somewhere else. But just pretend for a minute that part of the appeal of this website is communicating with people with similar interests about comics we want to learn more about, possibly even purchase. To answer that with "...hey, if you really need to learn what this comic is about you should go find another site" seems rather silly.
Edited Date: 2017-08-21 04:58 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-08-22 12:07 am (UTC)
every_spiegel: (Default)
From: [personal profile] every_spiegel
You just restored my faith in humanity a bit, sai.

Date: 2017-08-20 02:49 am (UTC)
jaxjyls: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jaxjyls
I'm a big fan of Korra and Asami as a couple and fascinated by Avatar tackling such issues.
But seriously, it was an weird move. The Fire Nation was interesting because while they were still quite evil and imperialistic they were the most "progressive" out of all the nations seen in the show both technologically and socially by letting women serve in the military and such.
Sozin being homophobic just seems like a "Oh he's evil, he must hate gay people too."

Date: 2017-08-20 05:07 am (UTC)
sapphite: (Default)
From: [personal profile] sapphite
Sozin's Fire Nation forbids dancing, has hunted intelligent species to near extinction, actively attacks other cultures and publicly describes them as inferior, actively teaches distorted history lessons to its children, keeps the civilian population subservient to the military, and is responsible for genocide.

Embracing technology and letting women serve in the military does not make the Fire Nation progressive.

Date: 2017-08-20 06:31 am (UTC)
liliaeth: (Default)
From: [personal profile] liliaeth
this so much

Date: 2017-08-21 04:18 am (UTC)
jaxjyls: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jaxjyls
still feels like an extra evil that was never before implied

Date: 2017-08-21 04:08 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] locuatico
Something not often mentioned about MANY imperialistic nations and dictatorships in the last century was how they further enforced homophobic policies and laws. It is often forgotten because of the holocaust, but before Nazi Germany, Germany was considered one of the more progressive countries when it came to LGBT+.
Then Hitler happened.

Sure, it was never implied before... but it DOES mirror several authoritarian regimes in the real world.

Date: 2017-08-20 05:57 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] tripodeca113
Yay. Now when will my damn copy arrive?

Date: 2017-08-20 10:04 am (UTC)
commodus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] commodus
They really are a great couple. Honestly, considering what Korra goes through in the show, it's nice to see a character actually enjoy some well-earned happiness.

Though I am puzzled at the rationale of this world in stigmatising same-sex relationships.
In this world where the existence of the supernatural is a certified fact, and people KNOW homosexuality isn't sinful and won't get you punished, by what logic could any government attempt to prohibit such relationships?

Narratively speaking, though, I think it's really sweet. And if it makes even one gay or lesbian reader feel better and safer, it's done it's job.

Date: 2017-08-20 06:20 pm (UTC)
lizard_of_aus: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lizard_of_aus
"by what logic could any government attempt to prohibit such relationships?"

Your premise is flawed. Logic doesn't play much part in intolerance. Personally, I believe it all just stems from the childlike rationale of "That's not usual. I don't like it." Any religious, biological, psychological or legal condemnation after that is little more than an excuse, a set of smoke and mirrors, to distract from the festering gut reaction against something considered weird.

Date: 2017-08-21 01:30 am (UTC)
seisachtheia: (Default)
From: [personal profile] seisachtheia
It doesn't have to be stigmatized as religiously sinful. It could be, oh, civic duty towards creating new citizens or whatever. Or undermining a harmonious order as set by nature blah blah blah.

Date: 2017-08-21 02:24 am (UTC)
lieut_kettch: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lieut_kettch
The Fire Nation reason seems pretty straightforward. Sozin probably intended to outbreed all the other nations so that Firebenders were a majority. Any union incapable of procreation was therefore taboo.

And lack of religion has never been an impediment to homophobia. Case in point: the reeducation camps in the former Soviet Union.

Date: 2017-08-21 08:59 pm (UTC)
full_metal_ox: (Default)
From: [personal profile] full_metal_ox
There's also an exquisite (and possibly relevant) irony in the fact that the Sozin Dynasty themselves seem to have a track record of breeding like pandas: we know of one child in Azulon's generation; two (at an interval that amounts to a generation) in Iroh and Ozai's; three in Lu Ten's, Zuko's, and Azula's (and Iroh's line extinct with the loss of Lu Ten); one in Izumi's, and two in Iroh II's (he has a sister as yet unnamed.)

Date: 2017-08-20 04:58 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daningram.insanejournal.com
Not bad overall, though I really hope Lin isn't the character who gets drafted into the 'objecting to relationship' bit

Date: 2017-08-21 09:17 pm (UTC)
full_metal_ox: (Default)
From: [personal profile] full_metal_ox
It was disappointing enough to see her reaction to Tenzin's leaving her for Pema (an actual "Grand Theft Boyfriend" charge? At a point when she would've been in her thirties?)

Date: 2017-08-21 11:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daningram.insanejournal.com
My main problem is that she always gets drafted into being in the wrong with regards to personal matters, even when she should be in the right.

Her and Pema, maybe that was justified if Lin didn't want kids. But I have a hard time seeing it, given how Pema told Korra to jump inbetween Mako and Asami's barely started relationship.

But Sue? Sue commits armed robbery, scars her sister for life and then uses her family connections to avoid punishment, and it's Lin who shouldn't still be mad? Did Sue ever apologize even?

And Toph, who keeps the identity of Lin's father from her her entire life, and then suddenly drops it in the middle of a rescue mission. And Lin's the unreasonable one?

It's like since Lin is a career woman, that somehow requires her to be wrong with regards to family. And don't get me started on how they worf her...

Date: 2017-08-20 09:38 pm (UTC)
theflames: The Joker best expression. (Default)
From: [personal profile] theflames
It's odd that they don't know any of this already. At least the way its presented to them makes it sound like it's completely new information. Other than the Air Nomads bit.

A lot of history and culture is heavily documented and shared in this universe, its not as though each nation is alien to one another. (though it would make sense if it was tbh)
Edited Date: 2017-08-20 09:40 pm (UTC)

Date: 2017-08-25 09:02 pm (UTC)
theflames: The Joker best expression. (Default)
From: [personal profile] theflames
I guess, this sounds fair, but then remembering Republic City, even here, is suggested to be progressive on that front. And it's a boiling pot of cultures (almost minus the air tribe) it seems like they'd speak about this stuff during there time there And speak about it in *contrast* to their parents cultures.

Sure they don't talk about it in the Water Tribe, but it's not like Korea didn't think she could not exist as a bisexual person, it wasn't brand new to her, since she was aware its odd that she didn't know where she stood with the rest of the world that she's traveled in.

But ultimately this in a nitpick of mine :P

Date: 2017-08-20 11:08 pm (UTC)
balbanes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] balbanes
Point of clarification: while Korra and Asami are in a lesbian relationship, neither one is a "lesbian hero." Canonically and per Word of God, both are bisexual.

Date: 2017-08-21 02:21 am (UTC)
lieut_kettch: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lieut_kettch
I'm holding out hope for the Earth Kingdom.

My headcanon: Wu dissolves the monarchy and declares free elections, becomes the Earth Republic's first PM, legalizes same-sex unions, and marries Mako.

Aaaaaaallll abooooooard the SS Wuko!

Date: 2017-08-22 03:29 pm (UTC)
shadowpsykie: Sad (We'll meet again Tiger)
From: [personal profile] shadowpsykie
I'M NOT CRYING! MY EYES ARE SWEATING!

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