X-Men (1991) #20

[iamrman]

Jean wants to have words with Betsy about her ongoing flirtations with Scott.

It's focused totality of her telepathic powers. 0/10. Worst X-Men story.

Comments

[donnblake]

Betsy too? Man, Scott really is catnip for telepaths, isn't he?

[scorntx]

Kind of surprising Maximus the Mad has never gone after him.

... hmm...

[beyondthefringe]

This puts Xavier's interest in Scott into a whole new light.

[bravest_spinja]

I think it has been suggested that Scott's almost preternatural emotional repression (Recent writers are theorizing autism--in any case his powers do significantly have an effect on his body language) adds a wrinkle to his interactions with telepaths.

[icon_uk]

This does not present either of these two in a good light.

Jean, ask Scott if you have questions about your relationship with him.

Betsy, maybe don't stick a psychic blade into the brain of one of the world's most powerful psionics.

[nyadnar17]

Tbh I miss Alpha Bitch Jean Grey who would brain damage people for talking to her man. I miss I Girl Jean Grey that used to be Storm's best friend and go clubing/talk clothes with her. I miss World of Cardboard Jean Grey who got fed up with Sabertooth's bs and took some time to demonstrate the difference between an Alpha mutant and an Omega.

Actually I guess every version of Jean that was more than just "the nice one" or "blah, blah, blah Phoenix"

[super_fly]

It's also clear nobody learned anything from this since it happened again with Emma

[tcampbell1000]

Yeah, this was about two pages before the OTHER Psylocke showed up and the two accused each other of identity theft so hard that it dried up their libido completely for years. Scott and Jean patched things up and got married eight issues later, but neither of them ever mentioned his attraction to Betsy again, and in retrospect, that kiiinda feels like papering over the issue.

[icon_uk]

First off, let's avoid gendered slurs like "bitch" on Scans-Daily.

Secondly, aide from the juvenile "I won't be mature enough to ask the man I'm engaged to if we're having relationship issues, I'll go and accuse the woman I think might be the one he's involved with, just... because" seems like bad soap opera (Yes, the X-Men IS a soap-opera, and that's fine, but this is the BAD kind)

Whilst she doesn't descend into psi-blasting here, I have issues when she does, because there are consequences for taking such approach, which i don't think are addressed very often (The Emma/Scott situation being an exception I'll get to)

Telepaths who don't just read minds, but edit them too, have a very disturbing, horrifying powerset, by default. (Much like empaths and other folks with "charisma" powers and the like). They can remove the one thing everyone truly values, agency. The ability to exert free will and make your own choices. (Just as Jean accuses Betsy of possibly doing here)

We've seen Charles misuse that power more than once and he's taken to task for it (Not always, which is frustrating, but at least sometimes)

Emma is never less than ruthless and uses her powers like a weapon all the time, which makes her powerful, and feared but also, no one trusts her completely (Except maybe Scott, who as mentioned elsewhere, has a thing with telepaths it's perhaps best not to dwell upon) and she will always be isolated. She knows this, and she does not like it, but accepts it as the price of using her powers the way she does. (There's a reason Kitty was genuinely appalled Emma was teaching "Ethics" at Xaviers)

If Jean is going to use her powers to lash out because of her temper, she can't maintain her position as "the moral X-telepath" or "the one everyone trusts" because how CAN you trust someone who uses their powers like that. Who would lash out with her telepathy rather than having a conversation?

When she confronted Emma about the actual affair with Scott, there was the underlying plot thread that Jean was becoming more Phoenix-like and less "baseline human" as her powers expanded, and she does realise that, when it takes Emma Frost to point out the ethical issues and cost of using your powers like that, it's something you should address.

So I agree that Jean doesn't need to be "the nice one", but she should perhaps be the one who is most aware of what misuse of psychic abilities can do (She's worked with Charles, Emma, Exodus et al, after all) , and acts with that in mind.

[nyadnar17]

Apologies for "b****", I'll keep that in mind going forward.

"If Jean is going to use her powers to lash out because of her temper, she can't maintain her position as "the moral X-telepath" or "the one everyone trusts" because how CAN you trust someone who uses their powers like that. Who would lash out with her telepathy rather than having a conversation?"

tbh I am not trying to hear that from the Superhero community. Maybe its just a side effect of how comfortable the lifestyle has made them with violence but almost ALL of them have no problems leveraging their powers or money when they have a problem with someone. The only exceptions are people like Cyclops' whose powers don't come with a "non-lethal" setting by default and even then the instant Cyke finds out you have a healing factor he starts ending his sentences with optic blast.

I don't think Jean making someone think they are a chicken for a bit is any more crossing a line than Hulk punching wolverine into a different zip code or Spiderman using his webbing to give me a 2-3 hour wedgie.

[deh_tommy]

Does it kind of feel a bit weird now to anyone else that she gets together with Jean and Scott’s kid?

[scorntx]

... well, it wasn't before, but now that you bring it up...


But relationships which are weird are kind of par for the course with Rachel.
Like her thing with Kitty.
Or the Shi'ar guy.

[lordnorj]

Don't forget Sublime and Ahab.

[scorntx]

I didn't forget, I just chose not to think ab-*starts remembering* gaaaaaaaaah!

[mastermahan]

It's not just Rachel - It's a Summers thing.
Remember Cable dating his dad's girlfriend's five clones?
Or how Havok is currently dating his ex-sister-in-law?
Or X-Man having a weird romantic thing with his mom's genetic duplicate?

The Summers tree is deeply ingrown.

[icon_uk]

"Ingrown"? It's a fractal in at least five dimensions!

[mastermahan]

And I didn't even mention stuff like Scott making out with the female clone of his future wife's lover (Laura was a clone at the time). Or Vulcan marrying his half-brother's aunt, who's also old enough to be his mom.

[scorntx]

Five dimensions? As if something like the Summers family tree could be constrained in such a small space as that.

[icon_uk]

Indeed

[windleopard2]

Remember Cable dating his dad's girlfriend's five clones?

Was Emma part of Jean, Scott and Logan's polycule? Not that it would have made Cable dating one of the Cuckoos any less weird.

[windleopard2]

That pairing basically sounds like it was created to justify the "Yes, your daughter calls me mommy/daddy too".

[donnblake]

awourg

[super_fly]

Exactly the kind of sound I'd make if I'd been stabbed in the throat with the focused/physical totality of somebody's telepathic powers.

A bit dramatic though, if she's showing Jean mind stuff couldn't she have just touched her?

[icon_uk]

Was never a fan of the idea that a telepath who can shred your psyche from the other side of the room, suddenly needs to be within four inches of their target to use their powers effectively.

[viridian5]

Seriously! "I actually could do this from a mile away, but it's so much better to have to be within inches of the person I'm working on!"

[blues32]

Truly an utterance that needs to be remembered.

[donnblake]

A new catchphrase, even!

[tcampbell1000]

As trash-TV as this plot was ("B-B-Betsy...*gulp*"), there was a real emotional rawness to it. It went to some interesting places and could've gone to some more, but this was about as far as Nicieza or editorial allowed it to get before stomping all over it with a much more boring (but much more Claremont-feeling) "Which one is the REAL Betsy?" plotline. In retrospect, it does kinda feel like a dry run for the later developments with Emma, which were overall much better handled.