Black Susan vs. the Stranger from Beyond

[stubbleupdate]

Two pages from Fantastic Four: Dark Reign






Susan Storm vs. The beyonder?

Like you don;t need to be told how that turns out.

Though this may not surprise you, I really liked some of what Dark Reign did. The designs on the Alternate Fantastic Four and their universes were really cool, plus the Bridge plot that led to the Council (which I adore).

Tag me with Fantastic Four, Sean Chen and Jonathan Hickman on creative duties

Comments

[yaseen101]

"no one yet had the gun to change that..."

Of course!

[kainnived.livejournal.com]

I liked the Sue/Johnny/Ben tripping through alternate realities, and Franklin and Val defending the Baxter Building..... but I had to roll my eyes and Reed's big 'discovery' that everything would have turned out alright had he tried to save the world alone without imput from anyone else.

God I hate Reed's ego.

[box_in_the_box]

Psychohistory basically becomes unworkable as soon as you meld it with the superhero genre anyway, because the two tropes inevitably combine to advocate a worldview of You Shut Up And Let Your Betters Run Things For You.

[outlawpoet]

The funny thing is that psychohistory was flawed in the books it was introduced in. Hari Seldon had to create a group to cheat and nudge history to fit his predictions, and it stopped working entirely because of a single superhuman(the math only works when everyone has roughly equivalent capabilities and goals).

The 616 is up to it's neck in superhumans and full-on ALIENS. How's your social analysis going to predict when the Kree come back to town? Or Galactus? Or the next Magneto is born?

[box_in_the_box]

Actually, the even funnier thing is that Isaac Asimov hearkens back to a sci-fi tradition that dates back to at least H.G. Wells, but which it's almost impossible to find any examples of today, because both Wells and Asimov created societes of progressive authoritarianism, and then presented those as utopian ideals. Part of the whole point of the Foundation novels is that you're supposed to be rooting FOR Seldon's "dead hand," cheats and all, to the point that the Mule was intended to remind readers of HITLER (pre-Internet Godwin's?), even though his rule was no less "legitimate" from a strictly democratic standpoint than the control of the Foundation itself, which was literally a secret conspiracy on a scale that would validate even the most extremist tinfoil-hat theorist.

Even funnier still is that Psychohistory, in spite of being treated by Marvel as this Bold New Idea, is so vastly out-of-date that Chaos Theory was already the final nail in its coffin.

[okkult3000]

Is evolutionary psychology the new psychohistory?

[shadeedge]

Nah, evolutionary psychology's already just about reaching the "general public discovers shit be wack" phase. Discreditation and then eventual acceptance of more modestly-phrased premises will be around in a year or so. The new psychohistory will still be in scifi stories if fictional and journals if not.

[stubbleupdate]

It's less of an ego thing and more about shedding his humility.

Read the final arc of Mark Waid's Fantastic Four. Ben recognises that Reed is very important to the world. It's about time that Reed started acting like it and get the job done.

[kainnived.livejournal.com]

Shedding his humility would be accepting the number of times he's gambled and lost on 'predicting what is going to happen'. Don't get me wrong I've read some awesome Reed stories, Fantastic Four was one of the first titles I followed as a kid (Hell I even have the entire 90sriffic Fantastic Force series).

Thing is he's smug, and he shouldn't be given the number of times he's gambled on being smart enough to pull off a Xanatos Gambit.

Maybe I'm wrong but it seems to me Reed is the best guy in the world to have in your corner when things are looking down. If you're in a jam Reed WILL figure out a way to save the day... But when Reed tries to be proactive, when he tries to create a master plan, when he tries to get out ahead of things, when he tries to predict people's moves ahead of time, it blows up in his face.

The entire history of the Fantastic Four seems to hold this as a moral. Reed is a hero, he responds to problems and invents solutions. Victor is a villian, who tries to instigate change on his own terms. When Reed tries to instigate change it tends to blow up in his face until his family (being the best family in comics) bring him back to his senses.

[cmdr_zoom]

All the way back to their origin, yes. (Reed's accounted for everything! Nothing could possibly go wrong!)

[lamashtar]

The problem is when its assumed that Reed does know everything. He may be a polymath and the smartest man in the world....but he sucks as a psychiatrist.

[yaseen101]

Which is especially jarring since in the original Lee/Kirby stories he was just distant and aloof but still had time-off to house play with Sue, cheer with Ben and be a father/big brother figure to Johnny. Not to mention his motivation for inventing stuff was to protect humanity and for humanity and stuff like Galactus only made even more driven to invent stuff which in turn made more aloof and distant to his teammates. Reed was easily the best character out of the Four during the Lee/Kirby era and not to mention the most powerful member on the team, easily dispatching powerful opponents through sheer brain power along with his powers. And if you dare lay a hand on his wife, you know you are pretty much in for an ass kicking.

[foxhack]

And they just keep putting Beyonder in crappy clothes. And that hair, agh. :D

[icon_uk]

Clearly it's an omniversal constant.

[stubbleupdate]

So... you're complaining that they're sticking to a constant design theme for him?

[foxhack]

It's not a complaint, it's more of a "poor guy just can't get a break" kinda thing.

You'd imagine someone would try to put him in clothes that don't suck sometime!

That's nice art

[jazzypom]

So what's a woman like Sue doing with a man like Reed? 2010, may Sue explore other horizons.

Re: That's nice art

[foxhack]

COMING SOON

F4: ONE MORE DAY

Re: That's nice art

[stubbleupdate]

Poor Franklin and Valeria.

Re: That's nice art

[yaseen101]

But I like them together.

[leikomgwtfbbq]

Why aren't there any more Western comics kicking around these days? I like Westerns. They're cool.

[autumn_lily]

Sue: ::hard stare::

Beyonder: ::hard stare::

Sue: ::cocked eyebrow::

Beyonder: ::hard stare::

Sue: ::wink::

Beyonder: ::the hard has just relocated::

[halloweenjack]

Sue could stick with that outfit forever and that would be just fine with me.

[cmdr_zoom]

I wonder if it's meant to be ironic that she's actually less modestly dressed than most whores of that period.

[lamashtar]

Yep. Decent whores wear dresses.