SERIOUSLY! Contains Trigger Words Behind the cut

[shadowpsykie]

Okay so I was thinking about reading some more of the Ultimate Universe comics despite my aversion to them, mainly due to how excellent Ultimate Spider-man has been... Now I had some issues with the Avengers/Ultimate Avengers/Ultimate Ultimates Ulitmization...

Part of those issues were that I though they were too... how do i put this... Perpetually stuck in the EXTREAM! 90's! if you get what i mean... exsesively violent, some what sexist (im Looking at you Ultimatum!), and just not too many likeable characters, admitedly Cap had his moments, some very good moments, but some how those moments were always counter acted by some thing else. But I have hear on here some good things about the Ultimate comics and have decided to maybe give them a try... so i did some research.... and I found this out....


I found this Entry on the 2nd version of the Ultimate Wasp... you know... after the first one was EATEN by Blob!....

In the Ultimate Comics: Avengers a new Wasp appears (called Red Wasp). She is revealed to be a former Liberator soldier previously known as the Insect Queen, now reformed with an obedience chip and serves as a member of the Avengers. In Ultimate Comics: Avengers #5, a flashback reveals that she was Petra Laskov, the wife of a Georgian activist. One day the Red Skull kidnapped them, held the couple's child at gunpoint, and forced her to kill her husband to save her child. She does so, only for the Red Skull to throw her infant out a window, and then order his men to rape her. Along with the rest of the Avengers, she fights the Red Skull only to be overpowered until he was fatally injured by Captain America. A short while later when the Red Skull was in the hospital, Petra, dressed like a doctor, walked into his room and shot him in the head, killing him.

SERIOUSLY! She was Kiddnapped, tortured and RAPED! REALLY? can some one please tell me ANYTHING good about the Ultimates that would counter act this? or that would out weigh this? Anything that would make this worth reading?


For Legality The Red Wasp/Wasp2




if this was an innappropriate post, Or i posted the Trigger warning Wrong, please let me know....



She appears to have the same powers as her predecessor.

Comments

[proteus_lives]

Well, from what I read, she's not a hero. She's an unwilling agent/vengance seeker.

Which works better with the rape/murder background.

What other female characters have been raped in their origins recently? New characters? Retcons?

[freezer]

The ones I know about:

Lady Bullseye
Catwoman (retcon)
Black Cat (retcon)
X-23 (prostitute specializing in extreme BDSM)

[proteus_lives]

I knew about the Black Cat one (which was a shame, because that was a pretty rockin' mini-series up to that plot-point.)

X-23? Does prostitution count as rape?

[freezer]

It pretty much does when your clients know they can do whatever they like to you without killing you.

[proteus_lives]

Yeah, but she's still there willingly. Wait, was she being mind-controlled or anything?

I think it is exploitation but not rape.

[shadowpsykie]

She's as teenager and she didn't really habe a choice in' the matter. Choice is a big factor

[proteus_lives]

The age thing brings up a wrinkle, she's a clone so she's only a couple years old, right? Or did she age naturally?

I haven't read the series except for seeing scans, how did she become a prostitute?

[shadowpsykie]

She was actually born, 9 months in her foster mother. Then was basically experimented on for 7 - 10 years

[freezer]

I haven't read the series except for seeing scans, how did she become a prostitute?

IIRC, she was on the streets, on the run from The Facility when she was "befriended" by a pimp. When he discovered she healed really fast, he started renting her out "special clients."

[proteus_lives]

Ah, thank you. That makes sense.

[blackruzsa]

Is 2006 recent?
Hawkeye/Kate Bishop would be one of those characters.

[proteus_lives]

I knew about that one. It didn't bother me because it seemed plausible, a bit overdone but plausible.

[shadowpsykie]

Kate didn't bother me to much it was vague. and I was lead to believe she was attacked but not sexually asaulted. I could be wrong about that. The way that was executed though was tasteful and empowering and not meant to demean or demolize for another chaacters benifite

[proteus_lives]

I think it pretty much stated she was raped without using the word rape.

[shadowpsykie]

I think you are right. But still, it was not explicitly used as shock value or to show how "evil" the bad guy was. It was showed to show how even though something bad happened to her, she rose above it. The rape and torture of Red Wasp was done to show how evil Red Skull was.

[proteus_lives]

"The rape and torture of Red Wasp was done to show how evil Red Skull was."

I agree, that's why it doesn't fly.

[shadowpsykie]

So... Where did we disagree? lol. Oh I never agreed about kate. When rape or violence are used to motivate or progress a man's story (ie give the hero something to rage about, show how bad the villain is) or is in any other way used to Shock and not to promote her own story. Yes Red Wasp killed tge skull, but it wasn't her story.

[proteus_lives]

I don't think we disagree.

I wanted to know if you thought such things as rape/torture/death should not be used at all.

The problem with this style of writing or character development is that it's overused, over-done and often lazily applied.

GrimDark was shocking 20 years ago. Mildly eye-raising in the Authority ten years ago. But writers like MM have gone to the well too many times.

Rape/extreme violence/torture are not blunt force tools. Carefully applied, they can still be used to great effect but it takes honest effort from the creative team.

It's the same story with horror flicks nowadays for the most part.

I think we're on the same page, I was just enjoying the thread!

[whitesycamore]

There's a fairly thorough list here.

[freezer]

I think the entry for Rogue might be referring to the original Genosha storyline. But there, she specifically states that the Magistrates never touched her. They just threatened rape ("And worse").

[whitesycamore]

Are you sure? Someone in the comments provided the caption texts:

All they did was touch her. Rude hands, ruder glances--taunting promises of things to come.

She couldn't stop them.

Then later, one of the guards says:

"I'm afraid some of my officers tooks a few.. liberties when she was being processed. What they thought was fun, she evidently felt was something else"

Sounds pretty clear that there was some form of sexual abuse involved, since unwanted touching coupled with sexual threats IS sexual abuse by definition - and that's only what was explicitly stated on page. We still don't really know what "a few... liberties" is supposed to mean.

<And that's the thing that's really fucking offensive right there. That leering, salacious ellipsis. The tone of that nasty little aside, with its thin veneer of "oh you readers misinterpreted my intent" plausible deniability. There is a way to handle sexual violence in comics seriously and respectfully. This isn't it.

[freezer]

Also, the page has a rather serious omission in the form of Mockingbird (and a lesser one with Diamondback).