Constantine #2: John Meets The Spectre

[superfangirl1]

Comments

[mrosa]

"Before I didn't want to die. Now I don't dare... because the Spectre will be there and I'll piss myself."

Welcome to the new and improved John Constantine!

[espanolbot]

To be fair... it's the SPECTRE. The thing killed an entire country just to spite two of its rulers, and that's not the worst of it...

[darkknightjrk]

He cooly admitted to doing horrible things to people, and when God's Vengeance comes to make him answer for his crimes, he uses his mouth to trick God's Vengeance to let him go, if only for the moment.

Sounds like a classic Constantine maneuver to me.

[icon_uk]

Agreed.

[nezchan]

I just thought, in a moment of weakness, "John Constantine is good with his mouth".

Is this what I've been reduced to? Oh, cruel fate!

[darkknightjrk]

I'm sure he wouldn't deny he's good in THAT way either...:D

[icon_uk]

He'd even point you towards the exact grafitti in the pub toilets attesting to the fact.

[filkertom]

Okay, just checking here, 'cause it's been awhile since I looked at Constantine, but... whatever happened to the plotline ("Dangerous Habits") where he sold his soul to three different demons, all looking to collect when he died?

Now that would be a fatal four-way.

[darkblade]

Reboot, everything that happened in the past is entirely up to writer discretion.

[mrstatham]

Not exactly even a reboot, more a different version of the character in general, given the Vertigo version was, up to a point, running alongside the version appearing in JLD.

[darkknightjrk]

Yeah--I'm pretty sure Hellblazer's always been at least mostly disconnected from the greater DCU.

[jlroberson]

Not entirely--in Delano's time and Ennis' it was still connected to characters like Zatanna, Swamp Thing and the Phantom Stranger. But that went away after those writers, and to the book's good, I thought. Ennis & Delano seemed to be doing it grudgingly at best, and the insertion of those characters mostly threw the tone they were trying to set.

I liked my Constantine best entirely away from the DCU. You can remind me all day how he started out part of it (and in Veitch's SWAMP THING stayed a part of it for some time). I do not care. Away from the DCU made for greater creative freedom and better stories.

[espanolbot]

I think that it was kind of wrapped up towards the end of Garth Ennis' run, when the First of the Fallen decided to just kill the other two Devils and make a run after Constantine on his own.

[filthysize]

Hellblazer is cancelled. This is Justice League member Constantine of the New 52.

[cainofdreaming]

I'm still kinda puzzled at the decision. Financially speaking. Constantine on the JLA gives him visibility, which would most likely get more readers interested in his own series.

So they cancel it. Buh?

[jlroberson]

No, they morphed it into something connected more to the kind of book JLD is. From the start, the Nu52 Constantine was entirely separate from the guy who died over at Vertigo. Starting with Lemire completely altering JC's backstory to...something forgettable and stupid.

And really, that's pretty much what this version of Constantine amounts to: an unnecessary change of a very rich character writers have spent a generation (literally) fleshing out, into something basically forgettable--but manageable, scaled down to something an average writer can work with, rather than a challenge reserved for highly competent writers.

Yowzah

[filkertom]

Thank you all for your various answers (which, somewhat surprisingly, do not conflict with each other). I knew the New52 had something to do with it, but... as you say, why deep-six a character with so much history so he can be in the JL, and not even use that to sell his book?

I created this icon for this group, and pretty much every week comic creators do something to justify my having done so.

[drexer]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Ok, I'm sorry but that's just the most 90's Spectre I've ever saw. No one can certainly say that the New52 ain't trying, it's just trying in a completely random direction.

[espanolbot]

On the plus side, at least he has some trousers on now. Hard for him to look menacing while wearing, essentially, just a hooded cape, gloves, boots and speedos.

[junipepper]

Man, speedos get no respect in the DCnU. ;-)

[icon_uk]

Depends who you ask.

[mrosa]

The '90s Spectre was actually very good. Have you read Ostrander's legendary run?

[drexer]

Not really no, I have a huge inertia when it comes to reading anything about the Spectre, specially because I find the way many people write him to be deeply problematic and it annoys me to no end.

I was mainly just commenting on his looks related to the arch-typical 90's character, but I'll keep an eye out for that run, thanks.

[darkknightjrk]

The design doesn't look bad at all. It actually kinda reminds me a bit of the current Martian Manhunter with the crossed strips.

[jlroberson]

Oh please. He looks like a wrestler.

[darkknightjrk]

Considering his last costume was wrestling briefs, I think it's fair to say that he looks less like a wrestler now then he did before. :P

[jlroberson]

Granted but IMO the best take on his appearance in that respect was Alex Ross--who depicted him without anything on but his cloak at all. I mean, he is a ghost. Ghosts don't need pants or briefs really. Censors do though.

[darkknightjrk]

Ross did do an amazing job with him, but it does look a little odd when he has part of his cloak in front of him at all times so no one sees his Spectre junk. It's either that, or he ends up with the anatomy of a Ken doll...which could explain his general pissed-off mode, I suppose.

[zapbiffpow]

Either Spectre's cloak shrunk in the damned wash, or Spectre Junior's toddling around the house with a green wedding train because Daddy took his cloak.

I liked that comment about fate always biting the people who chose to be loyal to Constantine, though. It's kinda Dark Tower-ish. Might check this out.

[md84]

To be fair, John regularly crosses wits with the forces of heaven, hell, and worse. It's no wonder that anyone who gets near that fire (guy was called the Hellblazer for a reason) gets burned.

[jlroberson]

But that's more than a comment, it's been a fact about JC since his inception--really, a central fact about him. Commenting on it, IMO, is no more notable than mentioning bullets bounce off Superman.

[zapbiffpow]

Thanks, you guys - getting more inclined to read up on Hellblazer. Though based on what I've seen so far, I've got a ton of Constantine lore to brush up on. Guess I'll check out the most interesting arcs and continue from there.

[silicondream]

The Spectre seems a bit out of character here to me. He normally doesn't accept ends-justify-the-means reasoning from anyone (except himself, cuz he's a special snowflake). And I can't imagine him being intimidated by "the world's most powerful mages," let alone worrying that they could actually overthrow the Presence. The Spectre throws down with anyone, regardless of power level--the Anti-Monitor, the Great Darkness, the entire Earthly magical community--and if he loses, well, that's just the Presence wisely punishing his lack of faith.

Unless it's going to turn out that the Presence ordered him to let Constantine go all along, I can't see the Spectre actually being moved by John's argument.

About the Cold Flame's Plan

[jsl1990]

Okay, so what I'm getting is that the Cold Flame, the villains of this arc, want to overthrow GOD. They have "found a way" to finally take down the Lord Almighty, and want to succeed where the Morning Star himself has failed for countless millenniums.

If that is so, than this is, without a doubt, the dumbest and most short-sighted supervillain plan I have ever heard. It's GOD, for crying out loud! If the armies of angels don't completely stop you, then the Lord will just swat them like bugs down to the fiery abyss! And speaking of Hell, I'm pretty sure Satan's not gonna look to kindly at some upstart mages trying to muscle in on the throne he so covets!

This plan, it's...it's like a man saying that he will eat a sandwich the length, width and size of a Hummer. Or if someone said they wanted to have a boxing match with the ocean. Not only is it crazy, but it's just doomed to fail.

[mistervader]

Today, the part of the Spectre will be played by a cleanly-shaven Undertaker.