God Is Dead #8

[superboyprime]

"In fact, I did a lot of reading of texts like Ovid and Gylfaginnig. The idea, for me at least, was to try and coalesce a reasonable interpretation of what kinds of personalities these Gods would have based on their mythological records and the kind of relationships their worshipers had with them." - Mike Costa

Comments

[drtechnobabel]

"But there was definitely a lot of thought put into the characterizations of the Gods that drew on some real research."

Considering what we've seen of the gods that have shown up in previous issues, I'm almost certain that this is a straight-up lie. Either that, or they're unfamiliar with the concept of 'research'.

Though credit where credit is due, they actually DID do the whole 'trickster gods behind the scenes' thing I was talking about in an earlier post! I'm honestly shocked that Costa did something I actually wanted to see. I mean, I'm about 90% sure that he's going to ruin it somehow, but the fact that it even showed up at all is something I did not expect to happen from what I've seen of this series so far.

[q99]

I dunno, Costa has Saci here, he's not exactly a big-name. There's some signs of greater levels of research.

[drtechnobabel]

Good point. When I said that, I was more talking about the previous issues, where pretty much every god that showed up was either super generic or wildly out of character. Then again, that might be due to Hickman's influence more than a lack of research.

[aperturedreams]

Hickman wrote almost all of the previous issues, so it's unfair to fault Costa, who seems to have done more research, on Hickman's lack thereof.

[arbre_rieur]

Where are you getting this from? They've outright stated that Costa did the bulk of the scripting (though not plotting) on the first arc. Anything else would have been a violation of Hickman's Marvel exclusivity.

Plus, that specific quote's actually from an interview *about* the first arc, so...

[aperturedreams]

Sorry, I wasn't aware of that.

[beyondthefringe]

Well shit.
Costa had to go and do the one thing that could truly rouse my interest in this series: bring in Coyote and other tricksters.

But I don't really want to watch my favorite god-types die horribly. :(

[q99]

Lesse, Coyote, Raven, Saci, Maui, and... I don't recognize the other humanoid god or the... is that a Jackel?

[endis_ni]

I can't tell you how weirdly gleeful I am that the Tricksters were all down the pub.

[icon_uk]

It DOES seem singularly apt, doesn't it? :)

[grumman]

Oh look, more idiots waging another holy war.

On the other hand, the part with the trickster gods doesn't suck, so that's something.

[bizarrohulk]

Thanatos seeing through the con because Zeus was acting out of character is pretty funny considering how Zeus was portrayed in the earlier issues.

[crinos]

Hey look I was totally right.

Coyote and the rest of the Trickster Gods just sat out while everyone killed everyone else.

[miramira]

Except for Loki.

[icon_uk]

Yes, well he seems to have his family issues over-riding his innate tricksiness.

[sir_razorback]

You know, a cabal of trickster gods is probably the best thing to come out of these books. Done right that would be awesome.

[icon_uk]

A little surprised to read Jehovah mentioned as "The god above all", by someone from a different pantheon (I'm assuming she is at any rate)

[majingojira]

It's being written for a largely Christian audience. It makes many writers far to timid to write the God of Abraham as . . . anything but the bestest and most awesomest god ever. Despite the archeology of its origins.

It's rare to have the progenitor Canaanite deities of the concept of Jehovah show up in fiction at all, and even rarer to find research on it.

For the record, it's primarily two from what I've read: The Sky Father El, and the war god Yahweh. From the textual language that I've been able to access as a non-scholar, El is the one who made a covenant with Abraham, while Yahweh was the god to bring the people out of Egypt.

IIRC, Ba'al (Ba'alzebor) and Ashera were also members of that pantheon, and were fully demonized as Beelzebub and Astaroth.

It's because I've done too much research on the subject that I find I can't really enjoy God is Dead at all. That and the "Western Religions are TEH AWESOME" slant is and things like Supernatural take when the Hindu Pantheon has flying saucers, power armor and goddamn nukes makes me laugh. An then fly.

[bruinsfan]

At least to give Supernatural its due, Kali was the the only deity in "Hammer of the Gods" that seemed to put up a decent fight against Lucifer and, more importantly, to survive the experience. Given that non-monotheistic gods are usually presented on that show as something that a single blue-collar thug can kill with a chair leg, that was a comparatively massive show of respect.

[majingojira]

Yeah, not gonna cut it any slack. I was turned off first by the contact lens demons, so I didn't watch. Then I heard about the Angel wank and now I actively avoid it. I know how they represent most Pagan gods and . . . I think it sucks. It's just my opinion on the subject.

[aperturedreams]

It may be written for a mostly Christian audience, but I find that the series is much more "religion sucks" (particularly with Hickman at the helm) than "western religions are teh awesome".

[beyondthefringe]

I'd love to read more on the Caananite precursor pantheon, as you describe it. Know any good resources for the casual reader (I.e. Not hopelessly academic)?

[majingojira]

The first chapter or so of "A History of God" by Karen Armstrong covers it decently enough. It peters off in interesting things about the Canaanite Pantheon soon after that.

The thing is, Canaanite had to be reconstructed and pieced together because of how things went. Not much survived, but more than, say, the Mississippi Mound Builders.

There are two videos (in a series describing the author's research and eventual journey into Atheism) which describes the important parts of that text, as well as going into detail on which parts of the bible were influenced by the Canaanite religion.

Here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlnnWbkMlbg

Part two doesn't cover it that well, so don't bother with it, but he does express there the same feeling I got. Even as a 'for masses' read, "A History of God" is pretty hard to get through after a while.

I'd watch the video then read the book. It goes into details on things like how the divine was viewed in the Ancient Near East that really are fascinating. "Be Not Afraid" was not just a thing angels and other divine beings said on a whim.

Also, the wikipedia on the subject isn't bad, it's just Wikipedia.

[wizardru]

These later issues don't even seem to be from the same series as the earlier entries.

The trickster gods hanging round in a pub is probably the first interesting thing written so far. What was the deal with the 'science gods', though. This feels like it has no ties to the previous stories.