starwolf_oakley: Charlie Crews vs. Faucet (Default)
[personal profile] starwolf_oakley posting in [community profile] scans_daily
A page posted from GOD LOVES MAN KILLS, Kitty Pryde said Nightcrawler had a right to be bitter over his appearance, but isn't. I'm not sure how true that is. Kurt Wagner can be VERY bitter over his appearance, just not all the time.
Five years back, I said some characters have a "more woobie than thou" attitude. They are jerks to characters who act/believe/think in a certain way, when they themselves have more of a right to act/believe/think that way, but don't. Basically, they *should* be sympathetic to the other characters, but aren't.



In UNCANNY X-MEN #394 (by Joe Casey and Ian Churchill), Iceman and Nightcrawler find out Chamber is the new boyfriend of a popular (British?) teen singer.

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Nightcrawler's (and Chamber's) "Woobier than Thou" moment.


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To be somewhat fair, the villagers in Winzeldorf thought Kurt was responsible for a series of child murders. The murders had actually been done by Kurt's psycho foster-brother Stefan Szardos. More info here: http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix5/szardosstefannc.htm

As Kurt and Bobby discuss media attention as Archangel arrives (This is when Warren had blue skin but feathered wings, before he could switch back and forth between Angel and Archangel.)

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This can seem like Bobby and Kurt are mad Jono is avoiding his responsibilities to the X-Men to actually be happy for once. It is more concern over "Jono dating a pop star" than concern over "Jono getting a 'real' life in the 'real' world." For example, if Jono was dating a London stage actress, there might be less "EXTREME MEDIA" in the matter. The British media is *crazy* in a way even TMZ can't match, so it might make little difference if Jono's new girlfriend was only a "little" famous.


Going back to "Woobier Than Thou," Batman is a prime example. "I saw my parents murdered right in front of me (and I still think it is all my fault), so shut up about using your powers to make the world a better place, but said powers always keeping you separate from that world."

Date: 2015-07-03 07:40 am (UTC)
minervasolo: (Default)
From: [personal profile] minervasolo
Jono is my favourite woobie. For all his ability to pass for human in a pinch by wrapping himself up, he's missing out on a huge range of human experiences that Kurt can still enjoy. Bobby and Kurt are right about the media fallout, but you never get a sense it really affects the wider mutant community, any more than, say, Ashley Cole cheating on Cheryl affected the wider football community*. This is all about bringing him back into the fold even though he's got almost no interest in being a full time superhero, and being brought back results in him going through the wringer at Weapon X.

*Trying vaguely to remember press scandals contemporary to this!

Date: 2015-07-03 08:28 am (UTC)
beoweasel: (Default)
From: [personal profile] beoweasel
Part of me is really bothered by Nightcrawler's lecture to Chamber about his appearance. I understand the context, and I know that Kurt has been victimized all his life for being born the way he is, but come on, man, Chamber is missing half is face and there's an enormous hole in chest cavity due to the violent manifestation of his mutant powers. Shit, he's incapable of eating, drinking or even breathing and is kept going purely by his psionic energy.

Date: 2015-07-03 02:34 pm (UTC)
burkeonthesly: (Default)
From: [personal profile] burkeonthesly
Also, Kurt's relied on holographic image inducers and paper-thin disguises to get by in human society before this (his workman's clothes and floppy cap from the Excalibur days, anyone?). "I'm not one for hiding myself," yes you are, Kurt.

Date: 2015-07-03 04:11 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
In his Excalibur days he wasn't usually trying to "fit in", he was trying to keep a lower profile from time to time. He only started using the image inducer again when he went BACK to the X-Men.

Date: 2015-07-03 08:29 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] philippos42
Wow, this is an obnoxious version of Kurt.

Date: 2015-07-03 03:14 pm (UTC)
lyricalswagger: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lyricalswagger
How DO they kiss??

Also, Bobby takin' a cold shower cuz of all the hot dudes.

Date: 2015-07-03 10:10 pm (UTC)
jekylls_salvation: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jekylls_salvation
She kisses his shoulder, he pets her face. It's very Christian-before-marriage.

Date: 2015-07-03 03:14 pm (UTC)
ablackraptor: (Default)
From: [personal profile] ablackraptor
In fairness to Kurt, Jono did start it with the 'you don't know what its like!' thing. That was a pretty stupid thing to say to anyone with a physical mutation, even if you have one too.

Date: 2015-07-03 04:15 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Agreed, neither side comes off well here; Kurt and Bobby with their "You have a responsibility" bit (when the actual answer to that is "No I really don't. Now I am no longer in your school, you are free to tell me you think I'm being irresponsible if you wish, but I am free to tell you to piss off if I wish.") and Jono with his "You cannot imagine the problems I have as a physical mutant" to Kurt.

Date: 2015-07-03 08:04 pm (UTC)
theflames: The Joker best expression. (Default)
From: [personal profile] theflames
But he doesn't know what it's like, since their mutations are completely different.

Jono doesn't breathe or eat, but he USED to be able to do those things, he knew another life before this, unlike Kurt whose always looked that way since birth (i believe anyway). So he has to deal with that knowing he had it a lot better before. Hell I'm sure the light pollution from his psiconic energy probably drives him nuts. He has a lot to be mad about.

There situations are different, so they can only empathise with each other. This isn't one gay man saying a lesbian woman can't understand his pain. These are two very different results under the same banner. But a lot of writers in X-men ignore that nuance.

Date: 2015-07-03 10:11 pm (UTC)
jekylls_salvation: (Default)
From: [personal profile] jekylls_salvation
Did Bobby really need to kick a table over?

Date: 2015-07-03 11:28 pm (UTC)
lyricalswagger: (Default)
From: [personal profile] lyricalswagger
He was ... emotional ... about seeing Chamber naked except for a towel.

See also the cold shower.

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