Date: 2016-10-02 07:04 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Charles Xavier watches you when you make love. And also when you drink tea. Whichever makes you more uncomfortable.

Date: 2016-10-02 07:30 pm (UTC)
beyondthefringe: (Default)
From: [personal profile] beyondthefringe
A thousand queeblits to the first person to do a meme replacing ceiling cat with Charles Xavier.

Date: 2016-10-02 08:52 pm (UTC)
captainbellman: It Was A Boojum... (Default)
From: [personal profile] captainbellman
I'm afraid Gingerhaze aka Noelle Stevenson has already seen that bet. Maybe save your queeblits before you challenge her, she plays for keeps.

Date: 2016-10-02 09:21 pm (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
Well, with this - https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/450x312q90/924/SUOxhM.jpg - to draw on for inspiration someone was bound to make it. I mean, it's like the makers of the movie were in the meme crowd themselves.

Date: 2016-10-02 07:21 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
The portrayal of Magneto really ruined this for me. I never read Morrison again.

Date: 2016-10-02 07:42 pm (UTC)
glprime: (Default)
From: [personal profile] glprime
Via Wikipedia:

When asked to comment on his characterization of Magneto, Grant Morrison responded: "What people often forget, of course, is that Magneto, unlike the lovely Sir Ian McKellen, is a mad old terrorist twat. No matter how he justifies his stupid, brutal behaviour, or how anyone else tries to justify it, in the end he's just an old bastard with daft, old ideas based on violence and coercion. I really wanted to make that clear at this time." Morrison also stated that the arc was intended as a statement on the rigidly elastic nature of the status quo in franchise comics, and that the arc had taken such dark leanings because "my loved ones were dying all around me" at the time of writing.

On the one hand, I don't disagree, as I've always somewhat shirked the complete turn-around of Magneto, and how everyone is just totally cool with him being such a "good guy," like being on the X-Men teams and such, when really, he's a Sebastian Shaw, Mister Sinister type, and that's always gonna be true, period. He's not really gone through a redemption arc that I've believed in, and it's just silly writers that tried to sweep away his earlier supervillain persona.

ON THE OTHER HAND, the later twist that the drug Kick was secretly the villain Sublime, a sentient proto-bacteria that had existed for millions of years and could take over people's minds and not-so-subtly influence their actions? A brilliant twist to explain the radical behavior departure.

IDK. Overall IDK.

Date: 2016-10-02 08:17 pm (UTC)
flint_marko: (Default)
From: [personal profile] flint_marko
everyone wasn't okay with him being a good guy. Cyclops and the others from the O5 didn't trust him, and the X-Men also had to deal with the Avengers a couple of times because of him.

And you mention Shaw, but I don't think the X-Men letting Emma join is much different, when she was arguably worse than him in their original appearances.

Date: 2016-10-02 08:51 pm (UTC)
beyondthefringe: (Default)
From: [personal profile] beyondthefringe
It's kind of odd. The X-Men have, it seems, always had a habit of trying to recruit their foes if at all possible. Magneto, Emma, Sabretooth, Juggernaut. Some have had changes of heart and come willingly: Rogue, Changeling, Frenzy, Toad. A few have been temporarily conscripted. And sometimes there have been alliances of convenience, like with the Hellfire Club. Hell, we've even seen former foes shack up with the X-Men when there's no better chance of survival, such as during the 198 days.

The only truly irredeemable -major- villains do seem to be Mister Sinister, Stryfe, and Apocalypse...

Of course to balance it out, I guess we've had so many of the X-Men become brainwashed and/or join the other side over the years that you could argue there's a larger picture of a grey morality at play. I dunno.

Date: 2016-10-02 11:23 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: (Default)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
The only truly irredeemable -major- villains do seem to be Mister Sinister, Stryfe, and Apocalypse...

I'd probably add Mystique, who keeps claiming to be rehabilitated, but never, ever is.

Date: 2016-10-03 01:30 pm (UTC)
bj_l: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bj_l
Is this your attempt at arguing Mystique is redeemable?

Date: 2016-10-03 04:02 pm (UTC)
flint_marko: (A terrible husband.)
From: [personal profile] flint_marko
No, it's a gif of Lady Gaga.

Date: 2016-10-03 04:50 pm (UTC)
bruinsfan: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bruinsfan
Is Amahl Farouk/the Shadow King still around in some capacity? I think he's pretty much irredeemable as well.

Date: 2016-10-03 12:36 am (UTC)
cainofdreaming: cain's mark (pic#364829)
From: [personal profile] cainofdreaming
The only truly irredeemable -major- villains do seem to be Mister Sinister, Stryfe, and Apocalypse...

And they have Evan as Apocalypse proxy too.

Date: 2016-10-03 05:12 am (UTC)
obsidianwolf: 3 of 3 Icons I never change (Default)
From: [personal profile] obsidianwolf
Stryfe also had a kind of redemption equals death moment in the Gambit and Bishop sons of the atom limited series.

When he sacrificed himself to destroy a Dark counterpart of the PHoenix Force that was incubating in the earth.

Date: 2016-10-03 01:30 pm (UTC)
bj_l: (Default)
From: [personal profile] bj_l
Shaw funded Sentinels.

Date: 2016-10-03 04:10 pm (UTC)
flint_marko: (Cyclops was right)
From: [personal profile] flint_marko

Date: 2016-10-02 09:36 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
Indeed, that interview was what made me realize there was no hope for Morrison. I enjoyed his Zenith, but after that I realized that the drugs had probably damaged him permanently.

Claremont spent 10 years slowly writing Magnetos change, and Morrison decided he could wipe his colleagues work away in a single trip to the toilet.

Whenever I hear the words "mad" or "twat" the image that comes to mind is the soulless Grant Morrison.

Mod Note!

Date: 2016-10-02 11:41 pm (UTC)
icon_uk: Mod Squad icon (Mod Squad)
From: [personal profile] icon_uk
Kindly refrain from making personal insults about creators on scans_daily. Critique their work as much as you wish, not the creator.

Date: 2016-10-03 05:43 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] onsokumaru
I'd argue that Lobdell ruined that before Morrison. He made Magneto pure evil and then killed him. Then Morrison came, brought back Magneto, made him pure evil and killed him.

Date: 2016-10-02 10:04 pm (UTC)
tigerkaya: (Default)
From: [personal profile] tigerkaya
I hated the Sublime explanation. It ruined the X-men for me in its story attempts of reflecting bigotry. It makes it lookalike a DC story of black and white.

Date: 2016-10-02 10:09 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] gnarll
Agreed. It was also such a cheap trick in a very poorly written story. To me, this is the only story I can immediately think of that ranks below Avengers Annual 10.

Date: 2016-10-03 02:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daningram.insanejournal.com
"When asked to comment on his characterization of Magneto, Grant Morrison responded: "What people often forget, of course, is that Magneto, unlike the lovely Sir Ian McKellen, is a mad old terrorist twat. No matter how he justifies his stupid, brutal behaviour, or how anyone else tries to justify it, in the end he's just an old bastard with daft, old ideas based on violence and coercion. I really wanted to make that clear at this time"

Fair opinion, I suppose. Though I'd respect it more if he hadn't said on 9/11, (paraphrasing) "Don't cry too hard, America. You totally had it coming for burning poppy fields in Afghanistan."

Date: 2016-10-03 06:18 pm (UTC)
wizardru: Hellboy (Default)
From: [personal profile] wizardru
The more I think about it, that's an odd sentiment from Morrison. Sir Ian's version of Magneto was something of a self-serving bastard; he was more than willing to sacrifice others for his cause (Sorry Rogue, you'll have to give your life for the cause, since I don't want to) and abandon others when they no longer were useful (TTFN Mystique, thanks for your service, say Hi to the Flatscans for me).

I appreciated how Morrison was expanding the X-Men out of their doldrums, amidst post-Austen depression. But I knew reading it then that most of it could NEVER stick in a shared universe IP that the writer didn't own. Robert Kirkman could do this sort of thing in Invincible, but stuff like 'Oh, mankind will be extinct soon'? Nah, not so much.

Also, Claremont spent ten years transforming Magneto, gradually, from a Silver Age villain into a three-dimensional character who had realized his hate had blinded him to the monster he was becoming. His heel turn back to villain also made sense, especially now that I've been revisiting that era with X-plain the X-Men. It may not have worked for you, but it worked for me quite well.

Date: 2016-10-03 12:54 am (UTC)
informationgeek: (Default)
From: [personal profile] informationgeek
Well that's a lot of death and fugly artwork.

Date: 2016-10-03 04:20 am (UTC)
dr_archeville: Doctor Arkeville (Default)
From: [personal profile] dr_archeville
One of the few things I liked about the first Civil War was how Emma Frost -- rightly, IMO -- called out Steve Rogers on how no one did anything when sixteen million Mutants were slaughtered by Cassanda Nova's Sentinels.

Date: 2016-10-03 05:13 am (UTC)
obsidianwolf: 3 of 3 Icons I never change (Default)
From: [personal profile] obsidianwolf
I thought it was Carol she called out when Carol came to recruit her to Stark's side.

Date: 2016-10-03 07:29 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] scorntx
She called Tony out for not showing up for Genosha during Civil War, she called Carol out just after Civil War, when she showed up saying "REGISTERING REALLY ISN'T BAD YOU GUYZ", with some mind-whammy thrown in.

Date: 2016-10-03 05:44 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] onsokumaru
And what did the X-Men do beside counting the deaths?

Date: 2016-10-03 06:39 pm (UTC)
obsidianwolf: 3 of 3 Icons I never change (Default)
From: [personal profile] obsidianwolf
We do know they were on the scene immediately after looking for survivors. (that's how they found Emma) The short lived Excalibur series(The one staring Charles and Magneto) also made it clear that the world governments were making it difficult to get aid to Genosha. With Xavier thinking to himself how all the humanitarian efforts were being handled by private groups like his X-corporation while the governments of the world simply placed a blockade around Genosha.

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