Slightly disappointing in the AintitCool news article about it was the mention that there will be no Donald Blake in the movie. I would have thought the dichotomy would have been an interesting one to play with in a movie.
It's especially odd because the whole point of the Jane Foster character was so that Don Blake would have something to do, so that there'd actually be a reason for the human identity to show up in stories at all. If there's no human identity, then why do you even need Jane Foster?
She may be the Alicia Masters to his Norrin Radd as they should have had it in the Fantastic Four. Now weak and humbled, Thor must find other forms of strength and pride beyond his sheer raw force of his might and power.
I'll be interested to see how the dynamic works without Blake (I'm glad they aren't using him, though; waste of space). I guess they felt they needed at least one prominent human character.
I'm glad they aren't using him, though; waste of space
I'd have to disagree, without Blake, Thor is nothing BUT a Norse god, with no human grounding. Useful in the long term, but lacking a useful grounding as a baseline. With Blake as a factor, we have the whole dramatically useful concept of Blake trying to live with an alter ego who is literally a god, and Thor can come to realise that a lame mortal has a nobility of his own.
Without Donald Blake this won't work on Marvel's take on the Odinson.
Unless they make Thor look like a mere mortal with a limp (after being cast down from Asgard) and have him be inspired by Jane Foster to turn to healing mere mortals rather than commanding more great adventures with his Aesir brethren (but leaving out the name of Donald Blake).
On the flipside I can understand why it would be hard to write logically how a Norse God becomes a mere mortal man Donald Blake, with a rich personal history of his own. Was he born Donald Blake? Would the Dr.'s he went to school with remember him? Would movie viewers believe "implanted memories", and all the pros and cons about violation of the mind those imply?
Yeah, I'm not sure how necessary Blake is now, in terms of story dynamics, but in any Thor origin story he's necessary, or at least some variant of the story. Because he's how Thor got from asshole Norse god to understanding of and compassion for humans.
I know it's incredibly immature of me, but I can't hear her name without thinking of THIS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEiqFPhqTK8) awesome scene from Popular
"Just blow a little kiss, to Lady Syphillis With any luck, she'll blow you one back!"
Hulk Movies: Both love interests were essentially reduced to 'watching' their man turn green and mean. Nothing else. I love how Liv Tyler has absolutely NO DIALOGUE in any of the trailers/TV Spots.
Iron Man: Pepper being the obvious interest who's role becomes a damsel in the end. And what in god's name was Tony thinking when he sends her to the evil man's office ALONE?!
Spider Man: Mary Jane. Gets kidnapped in all three movies and Spiderman has to save her. Are you comic guys sure that women in the Spiderman universe aren't all reduced to this role?
Batman: Rachel. Does nothing and gets killed. Renee was in there somewhere but for the life of me they decided to change her name and her character.
Superman Returns: Louis Lane. RAAAAAARRRRRR!
X-Men Origins: I seem to remember a movie with Hugh Jackman where he battles an evil force amd in the end it was the sole female character who dies. Kind of like how JJ Abrams always has a Russian guy pushing a woman to the side even though she's been assigned to that position and somehow the Russian ends up doing a better job than she does for no real reason.
Which brings us to Thor. While I cannot say for certain what her role is going to be like (having read no Thor comics), it can't be as bad as dying of a broken heart. Right?
To be fair, if they kept the name and still made her a corrupt cop then there'd be people saying how they'd "ruined her forever!" Best that they change the name, allowing people to think that she's a Montoya reference before going the opposite direction.
Which is why I made the point that he name and character were different. And while I was thankful that it wasn't Renee in the movie, this sort of thing would throw a wench into the prospect of Renee Montoya ever appearing in these Batman movies at all (if there will be any more). Someone will say that they've had a character like this already and move on. That's what sucks about it.
I actually kinda liked Gwyneth Paltrow's Pepper - she wasn't exactly a woman of action, but she played a believable, likable enough character, I thought. Still, each to their own.
I liked Pepper, but I was extremely frustrated by her lack of initiative. One of Tony's waldos actually demonstrates more independent initiative than she does -- she doesn't even have the idea on her own to bring in SHIELD -- she just runs into the guy while he's looking for her.
On the other hand, the scene where she goes "no, dating you would be very bad for me, no thanks" at the end did make up for a lot.
The impression I got was that Paltrow was playing her as an efficient secretarial type who was in just a LITTLE over her head. Helping him structure his life and keep his appointments, that's one thing, although Tony has a tendency to fluster her - but she didn't sign on to help him be Iron Man and install glowing thingies in his chest.
I agree with most of your examples, except for Pepper and 'Renee', the latter of whom was a totally different character. Pepper, on the otherhand, wasn't so much a damsel in distress as someone caught up in the fight (and Obadiah doesn't exactly catch her and hold her hostage, either), and she actively plays a part in defeating the villain, unlike Mary Jane or any of the others. Also, her banter with Tony is utterly adorable and a world away from the soppy, boring slush of Spider-Man. She actually had some backbone, for one.
Oh, I agree that Pepper was better than the ordinary love interest, I just thought that Tony telling her to go get Stane's files was the lowest thing. Just hope Stane wasn't in his office and hope for the best.
I dunno. Given the screensaver on that terminal, I thought it was TONY'S office, (Obediah's comment on the liquor seemed to support that,) and he hadn't expected Obediah to find her there. Not to mention that at the time, he thought Obediah was just corrupt, not murderous.
As a fan of the V for Vendetta movie, I'm all for this. Natalie will forever be Evie in my book - at this point, I automatically picture the actress with a shaved head - but having her play another comic book supporting role is A-OK with me.
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Date: 2009-07-13 10:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 01:34 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 04:15 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 05:08 am (UTC)As for Stan Lee..He'd make a great Odin..Right? Anyone? Hello? Echo?! :D
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Date: 2009-07-14 10:23 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 02:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 02:24 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 10:40 pm (UTC)Any bets on Stan's cameo?
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Date: 2009-07-13 10:58 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 11:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 01:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 04:56 pm (UTC)I'd have to disagree, without Blake, Thor is nothing BUT a Norse god, with no human grounding. Useful in the long term, but lacking a useful grounding as a baseline. With Blake as a factor, we have the whole dramatically useful concept of Blake trying to live with an alter ego who is literally a god, and Thor can come to realise that a lame mortal has a nobility of his own.
no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 05:38 pm (UTC)Without Donald Blake this won't work on Marvel's take on the Odinson.
Unless they make Thor look like a mere mortal with a limp (after being cast down from Asgard) and have him be inspired by Jane Foster to turn to healing mere mortals rather than commanding more great adventures with his Aesir brethren (but leaving out the name of Donald Blake).
On the flipside I can understand why it would be hard to write logically how a Norse God becomes a mere mortal man Donald Blake, with a rich personal history of his own. Was he born Donald Blake? Would the Dr.'s he went to school with remember him? Would movie viewers believe "implanted memories", and all the pros and cons about violation of the mind those imply?
no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 07:18 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 10:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 11:55 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 11:56 pm (UTC)"Just blow a little kiss, to Lady Syphillis
With any luck, she'll blow you one back!"
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Date: 2009-07-14 08:04 am (UTC)I miss it a little.
no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 10:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 10:48 pm (UTC)Hulk Movies: Both love interests were essentially reduced to 'watching' their man turn green and mean. Nothing else. I love how Liv Tyler has absolutely NO DIALOGUE in any of the trailers/TV Spots.
Iron Man: Pepper being the obvious interest who's role becomes a damsel in the end. And what in god's name was Tony thinking when he sends her to the evil man's office ALONE?!
Spider Man: Mary Jane. Gets kidnapped in all three movies and Spiderman has to save her. Are you comic guys sure that women in the Spiderman universe aren't all reduced to this role?
Batman: Rachel. Does nothing and gets killed. Renee was in there somewhere but for the life of me they decided to change her name and her character.
Superman Returns: Louis Lane. RAAAAAARRRRRR!
X-Men Origins: I seem to remember a movie with Hugh Jackman where he battles an evil force amd in the end it was the sole female character who dies. Kind of like how JJ Abrams always has a Russian guy pushing a woman to the side even though she's been assigned to that position and somehow the Russian ends up doing a better job than she does for no real reason.
Which brings us to Thor. While I cannot say for certain what her role is going to be like (having read no Thor comics), it can't be as bad as dying of a broken heart. Right?
no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 12:22 am (UTC)To be fair, if they kept the name and still made her a corrupt cop then there'd be people saying how they'd "ruined her forever!" Best that they change the name, allowing people to think that she's a Montoya reference before going the opposite direction.
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Date: 2009-07-14 12:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 08:56 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 07:20 pm (UTC)On the other hand, the scene where she goes "no, dating you would be very bad for me, no thanks" at the end did make up for a lot.
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Date: 2009-07-14 08:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 10:27 am (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2009-07-13 10:57 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-14 12:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-13 11:15 pm (UTC)"I only asked to borrow it so I could finally assemble that bookshelf I got at Ikea!"
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Date: 2009-07-14 03:22 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-07-15 12:19 am (UTC)(if this knowledge should fall into the wrong hands, we are SO DOOMED)
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Date: 2009-07-14 12:43 am (UTC)no subject
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Date: 2009-07-14 09:16 pm (UTC)