Action Comics #775: What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, & The American Way?

[superboyprime]

"Even though superheroes dominate the American market, there’s so much interesting stuff going on in other genres and indie books that I don’t think it’s fair for me to identify a 'trend.' That said, I think that the big companies certainly know who they’re marketing their books to, and a large segment of that audience tends to like their heroes a little edgier. I certainly fall into that land. So if there is a trend towards anti-heroes or darker material, it’s almost explicitly market-driven, not to mention shortsighted. We’re not going to get new readers (a/k/a kids) if every book is about classic superheroes being dissected and darkened. By no means do I think every superhero book should be vanilla ice cream, but there’s a reason that we all fell in love with comics when we were young. They addressed plenty of social issues and had a lot to say about the world at large, but as a whole they weren’t bleak. It’s that lack of hope that I find troublesome, and the idea that superheroes and the ideals they represent are 'corny.' Fiction can serve many functions, and doling out hope and inspiration 22 pages at a time isn’t a bad thing at all. But again, there are plenty of books to check out that embrace an optimistic take on the world, super or otherwise." - Joe Kelly

Comments

[silverhammerman]

As a parody of the Authority, there's some stuff here that works, because in spite of the satirical elements of the Authority there is very much stuff to be mocked. Manchester Black making offensive jokes, then claiming that he's "allowed" to make those jokes, and the over the top descriptions of the world's ills are decidedly valid points of parody for Ellis and Millar. Even the name, The Elite, points towards the fasc-y inclinations of the whole Authority power fantasy, though I daresay that Kelly does less with that than the actual Authority comics do.

It's all still desperately uncool though, a petulant and small-c conservative rebuttal of stories that Joe Kelly doesn't like. Even Superman's victory at the end isn't the victory of the accessible, hopeful outlook that Kelly is calling for the quote up top, it's Superman beating the shit out of the Elite, showing them that he could kill them and they're just lucky he doesn't want to because he is a benevolent, if lazy, god. There's the kernel of an idea there, of turning the tables and saying "power fantasy is all well and good when you're the powerful one, but what if you're not, and what if the superhuman arbiter of justice doesn't believe the same things you do?" but it doesn't play out as anything more sophisticated than "Superman's still cool and he could beat up you faves!"

This does make me desperately interested in seeing Manchester Black turn up in Morrison's Superman and the Authority, because this really is Superman at his more paternalistic and conservative.

[scorntx]

Given Morrison's attitude towards the type of hero Black and his lot represent in past works, with things like "your 'no-nonsense solutions' don't work", and the general trend of their works in recent (here meaning 'the last decade') which if it isn't Old Man Yells At Cloud-level is at least getting to Old Man Gives Cloud Sullen Suspicious Look, I don't know... seems more likely Manchester's role might be to, again, provide the role of person with arguments that are easily dismissed to show that he's wrong and Superman is right.

[silverhammerman]

True, but at the very least though the last time Morrison dunked on the Authority we got this immortal line from Superman talking about the Ultramarine Corps: "these "no-nonsense" solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel." So I think they've at least got a more fun perspective when it comes to unfair dunks.

[janegray]

Hear hear.

Brutalising somebody to win the argument that brutality is wrong. To me it really comes across as that Mean Girls meme.

Another poster below talks about a sequel story where Superman wins the moral argument by insisting on putting the guy in jail alive and unharmed even after being tricked into believing that he killed Lois. Even as someone whose reaction to a Lois murder would absolutely be "kill that fucker already," that still makes a lot more sense to me, it's much more coherent and an argument I can actually buy.

[jlbarnett]

they're the ones who were picking the fight with him though.

[janegray]

Well, yes. Just like villains who attack the heroes. If you believe that heroes are never justified in using excessive violence against villains, that includes the ones who claim to be heroes.

[jlbarnett]

I believe excess depends on what the villains can endure

[laughing_tree]

I imagine Kelly would see this as hopeful because Superman finds a way to defeat them without killing them. The issue's about, among other things, the tension between Superman's belief that "a little research and a little water and problem solved" with zero loss of life, and the Elite's belief that the world doesn't work like that. This is perhaps epitomized by the little kid's comment: "How can I stop you if I can't kill?"

So at first it looks like the Elite is actually right: Superman does beat them but only by meeting them at their level. But ultimately it turns out he didn't have to -- and crucially, he wins through creativity, not just outpunching anyone or being tougher. So it's hopeful because it shows you don't have to make that moral compromise, that you can triumph against injustice without dirtying your hands.

[silverhammerman]

Yeah I think that read on it is what Kelly was going for, but it's still a weak resolution. It's like the Ultramarine Corps quote I posted a couple of comments above: Superman wins here because the logic of the DCU dictates that he can. The aliens just need some water and understanding, and he can take out the Elite easily when push comes to shove. You do this story with the Authority and a Superman analogue in the Wildstorm Universe and it works out differently because the narrative rules are different.

Really, Kelly's quote up top is refreshingly honest because this story doesn't actually have anything to say about anything but superhero comics. The real world systemic issues it feints towards at the start are quietly dropped because there's no way to meaningfully address them, nor is there an interest. This story is about two types of superhero stories and which one Kelly thinks is better. At least Morrison's version isn't so self-seriously preachy.

[laughing_tree]

I feel stories like this are about the question which of those narrative rules are actually true to life? In the actual world, are deaths committed in the name of peace and justice necessary, or is that necessity just what the ones doing the killing claim because they can't or won't find better solutions?

To that extent, this kind of story is hopeful and aspirational, because it say it's the latter; but not especially persuasive, because as the Morrison quote points out, jet apes bear no resemblance to real world conflict. A guy who shoots lasers from his hand being able to bloodlessly incapacitate a flying saucer tells us nothing about whether a police officer can do likewise for a guy with a knife.

Then again, would a story about the cop and knife guy really be persuasive either? Even there, the reader's acutely aware that the writer's controlling all the circumstances of the encounter.

[icon_uk]

Yeah, this doesn't feel like Superman taking the Elite down by being "Truth, Justice and the American way Superman", it feels like Superman taking down the Elite by being a deeply patronising Doc Savage with added heat-vision.

[servant_iskandar]

All this IMHO, of course:

while Kelly's execution may not be up to par with the likes of Morrison (it's a tough undertaking, even when you have several years' worth of comics under your belt) - I feel the core of the story still holds up, albeit it could have used to be a longer arc so that the kernel got developed further.

Not sure how much of it was the writer running out of steam in the vicinity of the goalpost, and how much editorial, or if they thought that it was a way to turn the story around on its head.

Still, there are nuggets disseminated throughout, such as the kids not wanting to play heroes who don't kill -- not anymore, and the media and the people being in awe of the Strong Men. And if there's something that living here in Italy taught me, is that Elites come in waves, and we must not relax our minds, our hearts lest they get their groove going again.

The story still manages to drive that point through, although the compressed finale (we don't even see some things happen, as they're narrated, though the narrator is supposed to be truthful since... well, it's Big Blue) does it a disservice, because it's substantially a clean up of all the world-shaking events we've seen through it.

It is, perhaps, this "show must go on" part (the one I'm more inclined to attribute to editorial) that undermines it the most, more so perhaps than Kelly opting for a resolution revolving on fisticuffs plus a bit of guile.

Addressing the fallout from what happened for once, rather than wiping the slate as if Black & Co. were a passing fancy instead of planetary-level threats, would have certainly done a better service to the idea.

It is, however, a story with merit, because it does honestly try to remind the reader that it's acceptable since it's fiction is a very thin fig leaf and a powerful excusation both (I'm thinking of Millar whenever he loses control, of course, but I guess the textbook case here would be Ennis, especially his later works).

[thezmage]

I agree that expanding the story a little would be better, it's why I prefer the movie adaptation

[starwolf_oakley]

This isnt "Go chase a mad scientist" as Denny O'Neil had Green Arrow say to Green Lantern. But closer than we realize.

[mazway_75]

I actually liked more the takedown of Black in a later story he puts Supes through a wringer to make him believe he's murdered Lois Lane and Supes responds by saying he'll....make sure Black spends the rest of his life in jail.

Black: "You...this isn't an act....it's not that you're afraid of me...you...you really believe all this. Bloody Hell, I didn't think someone like you could exist."

Then kills himself because he can't handle the realization that yes, he's not some "new hero" but as bad as any of the crooks he goes after.

[cricharddavies]

For those who absolutely insist on murderous solutions, Clark does contemplate directly indicating his disapproval of Black's actions, and we're shown exactly what that would look like ... and then he says, "I will not dishonor my wife over you."

[lordultimus]

I at least appreciate they admit that the Elite makes some good points, at least to some degree.

[starwolf_oakley]

It is clearer in the "Superman vs. The Elite" DVD.

[lordultimus]

True.

[tcampbell1000]

I am impressed that all this got done in one barely oversized issue (I mean, it sure feels like the sort of thing you'd do in a six-issue TPB, no?). The biggest problem here is that the story sets up a hugely compelling scenario and has an absolutely riveting final sequence, but the climax does nothing to address the social and tactical issues that make the scenario compelling.

Morally, it has something to say for sure, but Superman doesn't exactly win this one because of the size of his convictions. I guess some of the authoritarian-lovers who supported the Elite will think Superman's cool again for beating them up and making them cry on worldwide simulcast, but it's hard for me to believe that his base isn't a little more scared of him after this, and Luthor's going to be playing tapes of this battle for months. "You see! You all see what he's REALLY like! The mask slipped! Sure, he tried to play it off like he was just kidding, but come on!"

And tactically speaking, I have SO MANY questions. How did Superman recover from the artificially induced stroke so quickly? Why DIDN'T Coldcast's final attack finish him off when before Coldcast's powers took him out by ACCIDENT? Why did they THINK he was dead? I'll assume the moon on which they're fighting has some atmosphere the Elite terraformed into it, but why can he talk to them and they can't figure out from where (did we bring back super-ventriloquism, just for this)? Are we to understand that he BIT Pamela at super-speed and disappeared back into the ether? If not, how was she poisoned?

HOW exactly ARE Pam and the Hat alive at the end? Coldcast I can see, he was just whisked away and Superman told a white lie about where he went, but collapsed lungs and a poisoned zoo-body are a little tougher to explain away. If it didn't go against everything this story is saying, I'd think they were actually beyond medical help and Superman was just preserving his no-kill record for the sake of public relations, having destroyed Black's credibility and therefore his ability to call Superman out about it.

But all these questions really boil down to one failure of logic. We're shown and told repeatedly that the Elite are more powerful than Superman. LOIS says it. LUTHOR says it. And then the Elite beat him into seeming defeat, which should at least take something out of him... but instead, we're doing anime rules, where the defeated, practically deceased hero gets up and starts winning awesomely when it's time for the big turnaround. After that, it's not even a contest.

It all feels a little tautological, like all those "What if Superman WEREN'T Superman" stories that were ultimately resolved by saying "Well, then he'd BECOME Superman, DUHHHH."

"What if... Superman fought amoral 'superheroes' who were much stronger than he was?"
"He'd turn out to be actually stronger than they were in the end because he's SUPERMAN, DUHHHH."

[cricharddavies]

We're told that people THINK the Elite are more powerful than Superman.

(And I'm not sure that Luthor does think that. He asks whether their ratings compare to Superman's, gets an answer, and then decides to 'wait and see who's standing when the smoke clears'. Would Luthor really think that someone else could defeat Superman when he can't?)

[tcampbell1000]

Well, yeah, people think that. Everyone thinks that, from the power-measuring experts that Luthor employs to Lois the investigative journalist who knows Superman better than anyone to the Elite themselves. Events seem to back that idea up, too, right up until they don't.

There've been other stories where the hero triumphs despite being outpowered, usually due to tactics, psychology, sociology, or some combination of those. And there's some attempt at doing that here with little wrinkles like the heat-vision concussion, but the Elite's tactics aren't too shabby either: they're creative in the use of their powers, generally support each other, and understand their enemy as he usually behaves. The impression created is that in the end, they go up against a force so overwhelming that all the tactics they could have wouldn't matter. Which itself could be a fine payoff, but it just doesn't match the planting.

(And Luthor does not have any problem admitting that others are more powerful than he is; it's in intelligence and cunning that he usually feels he is unmatched. He's not going to just keep challenging Superman to arm-wrestling matches: "The SUN was in my eyes last time, alien!")

[jlbarnett]

it's a world of cardboard thing. They know what Superman shows them he's capable of, but he's capable of more.

[cricharddavies]

And Luthor does not have any problem admitting that others are more powerful than he is; it's in intelligence and cunning that he usually feels he is unmatched.

I see your point, and it's possible that what he went through when Superman actually died helped him to move past the level of obsession that had him pitching a fit when he thought the Silver Banshee had killed him.

[jlbarnett]

Have you seen Superman get a stroke before? They're basically thinking he's a SuperMAN, and the things that will take a man out will take him out. But with his powers, why are they so dam sure?

And Black buying Superman's story about what he did? Combined with some of the other comments he made? He's as full of shit on understanding others powers as with his philosophy

I would say a bite on Pam is likely, maybe he even spit in the wound, adding some Kryptonian DNA to her mix which would explain things

and with the Hat, I don't think he had collapsed lungs, I think Clark was in that sandstorm and just grabbed him by the damn throat and gave a little squeeze

[leahandillyana]

Vanilla is the second rarest and most expensive spice in the world, what are you talking about?

[lordultimus]

Vanilla is regarded as the boringest ice cream flavor*.

*by people other than me.

[janegray]

You saw that awesome tumblr post too, hum? :)

[leahandillyana]

Yeah! It makes me feel somewhat better about our times to know how impossible the wealth we take for a given would be barely a century ago.

[fra080389]

Maybe not the better story but the line about the kid who wants be "cool" because "to kill is more funny" was good tho. I can see how scary that can be'.

[zachbeacon]

I’m glad opinion seems to have shifted on this one. It always bugged me that the story that was clearly written as a response to the “Why doesn’t Batman simply kill the Joker?” types has Superman using such brutal methods. I don’t love it when heroes with no killing codes do things that would cripple opponents but Superman lobotomizing people seems particularly bad just because he’s Superman.

Unrelated but this really highlights why I hate that the Authority was brought into the main Nu52 universe. Any interaction between the JL and the Authority that doesn’t end with the Authority in jail is a bad story. Also there’s no reason for the Elite to exist at all because they’re now a bad copy of a bad copy (whereas before they were far enough removed from the League to be their own thing).

[strejdaking]

Superman didn't lobotomize Black, as he says, he only pretended he did. Not helped by the movie omitting that for some reson, but here it was part of the facade.