I Am Not Starfire

[t209]

https://www.dccomics.com/graphic-novels/i-am-not-starfire
So tomorrow is the release for this "comic".

Tons of dislike but the "review" being from Clownfish TV and It's A Gundam...I have issues with anti-SJW even if they kinda have a point.
So any thoughts?

Comments

[buttz]

I'm glad that DC has taken more of an interest in being inclusive with its offerings in the last few years, but I wish that they weren't doing it in such a way that feels so overwhelmingly forced and awkward. I'd rather have one or two non-traditional characters who actually become a part of the proper DCU in prominent roles than more throwaway side characters and outside titles that will largely be forgotten in a few years.

[deh_tommy]

I’m honestly looking forward to this. I think people are just being oversensitive and somehow miss the point when that’s laid out right there in the title.

[lizard_of_aus]

I was much more rankled by the cover long before I actually learned about the premise, and got more context for this raven-looking character being put into a Starfire role. By itself, the premise of struggling to live up to the legacy of a superpowered superbeautiful parent you have nothing in common with could have some merit, even if it quite blatantly channels the author herself.

I just feel like this story could've been better received (or if nothing else, should've been) if the characters involved weren't the actual heroines, but rather expies of Starfire, Blackfire and all the rest. Loose enough that new canons could be fitted in, but close enough that the general point of the story comes through. That way, it wouldn't have to beg the fans' questions of 'why couldn't Starfire and Nightwing have had a kid'?

[leahandillyana]

Mariko Tamaki is not a good writer. The only her story I enjoyed was Thor and Loki, and it was only due to its humorous nature. I am 100% sure this book is gonna suck. Most of DC Ink sucks, I can think of four books that didn't, and even they were not that good.

[janegray]

Oh thank God I'm not the only one.

I see her writing praised all the time, but I keep trying to give it a chance and keep absolutely hating it. Every single thing of hers I've read, I've viscerally loathed. And I hate that her terrible writing always gets the best art. Somehow she always manages to score the very best artists. Even if the writing sucks, the book still look so pretty that the first impression is a positive one, it takes a whole for it to sink in that the art is carrying the whole thing.

Which kinda makes me feel bad because she is a favourite target of demented gaters. She gets a ton of harassment from those assholes.

[stubbleupdate]

Some good, some bad.

Her first arc on She Hulk and Supergirl: Being Super were good. The rest of her She Hulk run and all of her Wonder Woman were...not great.

She is being kept very busy, so somebody likes her.

[janegray]

YMMV.

I completely respect the opinion of those who liked it. But my personal opinion is that Supergirl: Being Super is one of the worst comics I've ever read. I ended up selling the TPB for like 3 bucks on ebay, because I can't bring myself to outright throw any comic in the trash can no matter how much I hated them, but I wanted it out of my library fast.

As for her Wonder Woman run... Well, I admit I'm highly biased here, because I loved Max in JLI and always resented DC for turning him into a villain just because, and I quote, "he was kinda shady." God forbid we have a gray-ish hero, right? But Mariko Tamaki went out of her way to characterise him as far more loathsome than any other writer ever had before (and it's not like those writers had been holding back, so that's really saying something), having even Diana (Diana, the woman who reached out in compassion to fucking Nazis) claim that he was some kind of abomination who deserved to die. That really, REALLY pissed me off.

[cyberghostface]

It’s an AU self-contained graphic novel so it’s stupid to get upset over in my opinion. The outrage over this is ridiculous.

[flash_fan]

My thoughts exactly, if you can't experiment with the characters in what is essentially an Elseworlds where can you?

It costs nothing to ignore this title if it's not your cup of tea. This is obviously for the YA crowd.

[redmagpie]

Yeah, people are like acting like this is some sort of insult to Starfire and the entire comic industry and it's like... they need to chill. They really, really need to chill.

[thatnickguy]

This, exactly. It's no different than Tiny Titans existing at the same time as Young Justice cartoon or the regular Teen Titans comic.

All the outrage is coming from the usual Comicsgate assholes, anyway. They're not worth listening to.

[thatnickguy]

Why did you put the word "comic" in quotes? It's a comic. Whether you think it'll be good or not won't change that. It's a YA graphic novel, but it's still a comic. And to be clear, when I say "comic," I mean within the medium of comics. Not all comics are graphic novels, but all graphic novels are comics.

Plus, DC has been putting out a great number of YA or kids graphic novels in the last few years. Same as Marvel, they've been trying to catch up to Scholastic's success. Plus, Mariko Tamaki wrote one just a few years ago, Harley Quinn: Breaking Glass, which was pretty good.

As cyberghostface said, the outrage for this is ridiculous. The target audience is young adults, same as the other DC YA books. You can ignore it and the world will continue on.

[blueprintstyles]

Mariko Tamaki's writing is 50/50 for me. With the right character I really like her choices, but others... meh. Gonna go in with no expectations.

[tinygaylaura]

I've loved what I've read of her stuff, including this

[bmaryott]

I don't think this is anything more than "teenager becoming an adult" angst. (I work in a college and I see a *LOT* of that!)

I don't read any "SJW" theme here.

[janegray]

I saw some guys claim that a comic with Conan was SJW. Why? Because he had an orgy with 3 women, and they all came and praised him for being a mindful lover.

Can't make that shit up. Literally anything is SJW so long as it doesn't have a male main character who is actively shitty to women while the narrative presents it as a good thing.

[tinygaylaura]

I assume their hatred there is envy

Making three women climax at once?

That's three more women than any of these unfuckable pieces of human garbage will ever make orgasm in their entire lives

[crinos]

Its SJW themed because the main character is an overweight queer person.

See, when they say something has "SJW" themes, or "forced Diversity" or "Pandering", what they really mean is "This has character in it who aren't CIS white straight people who I personally want to fuck, and I am angry and offended by that because I don't want to be reminded those sort of people exist"

See also Last of Us 2, where one of the main characters is Abbey, a young woman who has *Gasp* Muscles, which was so rage inducing it prompted some particularly clueless shitheads to send death threats to the characters Voice Actor Laura Bailey.

These people don't like the fact that people exist that aren't them. They want those people to go away, or at the very least remain quiet and unseen. They want every story to represent them and them alone, and they get very angry when a story is told that's about someone who is not them.

Which is, as I said, I bought two copies off of Amazon, and will be donating one to my local library, because I have been blessed with some extra disposable income of late and I am just petty enough to want to help this book succeed and get it more exposure just as a personal fuck you to them.

[bmaryott]

Damnit, you're supposed to make them flail around mindlessly, saying random things while trying not to admit they're being tiny.

[cyberghostface]

Death threats are wrong no matter what but people hated Abby because the first thing she does is beat a beloved character to death.

[crinos]

I will admit I didn't play Last of Us, and I mainly know about all of this from Jim Sterling's videos on the subject, but I think results may vary on how "Beloved" Joel actually was.

And yeah, that was a part of it, but Abbey was also hated for being a lady with big muscles (well, bigger than average.I've looked up pictures of her and....okay she has some definition on her arms. But the way some people go on you'd think she was Brock Lesnar, but as I said we know the real reason they don't like her).

[cyberghostface]

By fans, yes he was. Not as much as they liked Ellie but he was beloved.

Abby being muscular was a point of contention but it was not the reason why the actress received death threats. (And again death threats are unacceptable in any situation.)

[thanekos]

The use of Blackfire in a story about " Starfire's explicitly opposite, frustrated kid " is one of those " .. we're only doing this now, in 2021? " things.

[quatoria]

You think "anti-SJW" "kinda have a point?"

[t209]

At least in "pandering by the corporation rather than genuine beliefs", and "bland morality play".
Edit: Just my old beliefs before becoming "Julian the Apostate" from that type.

[cyberghostface]

I agree that there is a bit of that in comics nowadays but this book is a fairly standard coming of age story from what I’ve seen. Most of the wank is because the main character is overweight.

[beyondthefringe]

This isn't all that bad.
It's not all that great, also.
It's kind of typical YA material... a bit formulaic and predictable, with some decent parts and a solid enough story. It's really something that requires next to no actual pre-existing knowledge of anything but, say, the animated Titans, as it's modeled around a typical middle grade/young adult storyline about living up to your parents' expectations, finding your own path and identity, and romance.

To me, language, smoking, and college woes aside, this had a middle grade voice, like I could easily have seen the characters as 12 instead of 17 or whatever.

What I DO like is that Mandy is presented as queer without any negativity, bias, or prejudice from her friends, family, classmates or crush. Any negative attention she gets comes for other reasons. So yay for an LGBTQ romantic storyline in a YA AU of a random comic book character?

[crinos]

I ordered two copies. One for myself, and one I intend to donate to my local library.

Because at this point I don't even care if its well written or not, the backlash and hate against this book because "How dare they give Starfire a chubby goth daughter" really burns my biscuits.

I will probably have more to say tomorrow when I get the book, but we will see.

[jlbarnett]

it's not about that, it's about how dare they make Starfire a bad mom to her chubby goth daughter

[crinos]

That may be part of it, but looking at, say, the comments on the youtube video were rather rage inducing. Accusations of Mandy being a "Self insert" and other comments.

Like I'm sure the comic wont be without its flaws, but at the same time the backlash certain groups can be rather rage inducing.

[kurenai_tenka]

From the parts I read, I felt bad for Starfire because she seemed to be doing her best/trying really hard. Teenagers are just nightmares to deal with lol.

She certainly had no issues with how her daughter was dressing.

[tinygaylaura]

The story isn't about Starfire being a bad mom

The story is about how Mandy and Starfire have trouble relating to each other. Mandy feels like she's not what her mom wanted her daughter

Starfire doesn't know how to talk to her daughter about what she's going through right but wants to be a good mother to her

It's a very common situation. By the stories end Starfire and Mandy are both in a better place emotionally

[t209]

But the issue is that she’s a Titan, all of them are family.
Like where was her dad?
Or Uncle Flash or Aunt Raven.
I mean Titans raised Lien.
The issue being an old comic reader who’ve seen detractors who never heard of Young Avengers or characters who would be “woke” but actually well-written, or proponents who had no idea of previous entry.

[karmakaze]

Who is the father? Where is the father? Where are the rest of the Titans? They practically raised Lian as an extended family, but Mandy's apparently never met any superhumans but her mom? If they're not using any of Kori's found family and connections, why did they pick Starfire as the mom for a story like this?

Kid of superhero has no powers and feels alienated by it all then has to deal with fallout of the superparent's past has been done before, and there's a lot to be done with the premise. I just think Starfire is a really weird choice here.

[donnblake]

Based purely on the previews- the bits with Mandy at school awkward flirting with her crush are very cute. I don't see anything in the preview that requires the mom to be Starfire rather than any other Magical Sparkling Princess, but maybe that comes later- or if not, hey, brand recognition, I guess?

[kurenai_tenka]

Eh, I've skimmed it and it seemed fine. I still need to actually read it. I am interest to see what the outrage is about though, if nothing else I'll probably be pretty amused by that.

[tinygaylaura]

I loved this book

I thought it was a very good portrayal of teenage coming of age angst in a superhero universe. I thought the main character was handled well. Sometimes she could be a jerk but you now what, teenagers can be jerks. Fucking up is part of growing up. She was flawed in a way that made me feel for her and I was glad when things got worked out and glad she was in a better place at stories end