Scans_Daily

Anybody else uncomfortable with everybody in this group safe for Blob and Monet being queer and having acted as secret police arresting people for straight sex? Or that pregnant Asian mutant with Chinese surname and common Japanese noun for name? Or with the guys taking their frustration out on public property after recovering their memories?

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can't speak for the names...
but the rest, yeah I am ok with it. If you are going to "erase" the memories of people and police things like love? Put the ones with the most complicated emotional feelings (AKA queer love) in charge of it. It's implied here that removing love, and in this case a love that others have ostracized and hated for a long time, left a hole in them. this hole is bigger and more damaged than others because it was a love that was abnormalized. so there is going to be more aggression and more hurt there and X-Man is using it to kinda harness that.

them taking out their frustration on public property? hell yes. One, they realize it's a false reality so, why the eff care? two... "The First Pride" was a Police Riot. They threw bricks, and broke things, because they were tired of being treated like second and third class citizens. violent protest, and violent actions in THIS specific case? yeah totally fine and in character for me and I am effing LOVING it!

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Among conservatives, there's the constant fear that if queers are allowed rights, they will start denying rights to the straights. There are several novels about it. And this comic plays directly into this fear. Even the fact that a woman of colour reproduces when it is forbidden and is a literal rat, an animal associated with rapid reproduction but also spreading diseases, plays into racist and anti-immigration fears. I find the comic the most insultingly homophobic and racist story that was not (probably) supposted to be homophobic or racist.

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lol Leah chose rats because she loves rats and had a pet rat once.

http://www.oprah.com/inspiration/how-a-pet-rat-saved-me-from-loneliness

And it's not a case of "queer people denying rights to the straights". They're not the ones running the world, Nathan is. They've been brainwashed into even forgetting that they were queer in the first place.

Edited Date: 2019-06-26 04:07 pm (UTC)

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as a queer person of color (latino in this case, the current whipping boys for "disease" "drug dealers, criminals, and rapists" in the united states climate) I find this freaking EMPOWERING.

I honestly don't care if it makes conservative white people "uncomfortable" people forget that queer people don't just march in parades and wave flags, and get married "just like regular people" and like to "dress up" and be campy... No we are tired, we are angry, and yes they should be afraid of us because THIS is what they did/are doing to us. They are repressing our rights, our ability to be ourselves, our safety, our lives. what do they EXPECT to happen. Pressure builds and things explode. THAT is what is happening in this story. This is NO different than Handmaid's Tale. except with queer mutants.

so screw making conservative (white people) uncomfortable and nervous. let them be.

Edited Date: 2019-06-26 03:59 pm (UTC)

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Oh, conservatives would be utterly comfortable with this comic, as it is something they could point to and say "See? We were right the whole time. Give them an inch, they will tore your arm. "

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If any conservative tried that line of thinking with this comic their argument would be dismantled in a matter of seconds.

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I really wish I could like comments on here... "like"

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then they, like others who are reading this, will completely miss the point... these people are being repressed and withheld their rights. they are being FORCED to police others, and their anger is let loose they realize what has actually been done to them. so yeah. the message that is CLEARLY being sent, is "Stop policing who we can and cannot love, stop repressing who we are, because if you DON'T we will have no other choice but to rise up. AGAIN." we have fought, we still fight, and we WILL fight again if we have to.

but people will willingly ignore context just to see their point of view so really it doesn't matter what conservatives point to here. what matters is what queer people pick up and what I am picking up is a group of people fighting back after being repressed.

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Queer people pick up the notion in every monster story and most villain stories - after all, modern villains tend to have sympathetic backstories and be social reformists to varying degrees. Yet priviledged audience members tend not catch on nuance and be satisfied when the monster is killed and the villain is crushed. I fear most readers would enjoy Jubilee & friends crushed, from what I see of comic book readers in America.

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I give all readers more credit than that. mainly because this isn't really nuanced.. it is CLEAR what is happening... people have had their true selves repressed and forced to "Fall in line" are fed up and fight back.... not much subtext there. it's all text.

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locuatico

Conservatives do not need this comic to do so. They are the same people who fought teeth an nail to destroy the civil Rights movement, to demonize Martin Luther King to hell and back.
And now? After killing King they are using his memory to pretend he would be against the current movement.
Same with the original sufraggettes, whom they demonized back then and NOW are putting on a pedestal as an example of moral decay with the current feminist movement.

They will use anything. But you know what? If it is empowering to queer people and people of color? (As many in these comments have said). THAT makes this story worthy.

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deh_tommy

Ehhhh, I get that that's cathartic and all, but in my opinion saying "they should be afraid of us" is a bit worrying because fear just makes people double down on their beliefs even harder (especially when that fear is based around a lack of understanding).

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I admit, I am a little worked up. But sometimes it takes being afraid of something, or making someone afraid, to get change happening. I mean, Stonewall was an act of violence, it personified the fear that many conservatives had, but without it we would be set back 50 years now.

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Stonewall riots, by themselves, changed nothing, like the many queer riots that came before them. The riot was chosen as a symbol for the emerging queer activism. Just like Rosa Parks was chosen as a symbol. It's all politics. They might have well chosen something else, like the date homosexuality became legal in (insert your country). And, even then, political successes of queer activism are all in last twenty some years, with the earliest coming from European activism, which had completely different origins.

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The writer Leah Williams is a queer woman and it’s not even being depicted as “gay people arresting straight people”.

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deh_tommy

Jubilee's not queer, is she? Plus, they're not the secret police for heterosexuals, they're the secret police for any form of intimacy, love and even basic familial connection.

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She had two different girlfriends in The Runaways. While technically they are supposted to fight intimacy, in praxis we see them opressing straight couples. Coockoos may be disliked, but Extremists were not on their tails, for example. The subtext is very loud to me, particularly in light of some other stories being greenlit by Marvel.

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You're referring to an alternate reality Jubilee from Battleworlds. Not the 616 one. So in other words half of this team is straight.

Edited Date: 2019-06-26 05:12 pm (UTC)

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Jubilee is Jubilee. People who are interested in her enough to had her in the comic remember that story.
I see the problem in here is that you all use watsonian interpretation, while I rely solely on doylist approach.

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'Jubilee is Jubilee.'

That's not how it works. An AU Mary Jane was a lesbian in an Exiles comic. That doesn't mean the 616 Mary Jane is.

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angelophile

There's nothing in 616 to invalidate a queer reading of Jubilee and she has never canonically been stated to be straight or, not asexual or any other reading that can be inferred from her comic appearances.

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That could be said for almost any character. But that’s not the same thing as citing her as an example of the group being primarily made up of queer characters when she has never been identified as such.

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angelophile

Apart from the times she has, which you are dismissing

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When?

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super_fly

The one time off the top of my head would be the time she hung out with X-23 who let her feed off of her, and that alone had enough gay energy to power Staten Island for a thousand years

Edited Date: 2019-06-27 11:46 pm (UTC)

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angelophile

The comics already mentioned.

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The AU miniseries?

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donnblake

"Jubilee is Jubilee and therefore all portrayals of Jubilee are portrayals of a queer character," doesn't seem to square terribly well with "Gamora is canonically dead at the end of Avengers: Endgame," though.

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Once again, you guys are using only in-universe interpretation while I foucus on authorian-level interpretation.From an authorial point of view, all portrayals of character A add up to how character A is perceived by fans, even when the distincitive events took place outside the mainstream version of the character. Miller's Batman in nothing like Earth Prime Batman, but the comic was so popular that that interpretation bled into mainstream Batman stories almost immediately after release, and, after years, Batman became Miller's Batman, because readers liked the story so much. Returning to Jubilee, 616!Jubilee may not be bi/les, just like 616!Collossus is not gay, but fans of those characters, who are not that popular as to star in hundreds of series, most likely have read those stories. I honestly expected to see Collossus in this series, he's probably absent because another writer is using him.

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donnblake

Right. Except you're not, because from an Doylist perspective, Gamora is not dead at the end of Endgame.

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“Once again, you guys are using only in-universe interpretation while I foucus on authorian-level interpretation.”

In terms of canon in-universe is what matters.

Referring to this version of Jubilee as queer is incorrect.

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angelophile

Straight is not the default.

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I wasn’t suggesting otherwise...?

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deh_tommy

The Secret Wars Runaways series was an alternate reality tale, wasn't that?

What are the series you oppose being greenlit, might I ask?

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The "Vader's Fangirl" story and the implications of Avengers: Endgame deaths. I wrote an essay on them a few months ago: https://archiveofourown.org/works/18621742

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as damaging as compartmentalizing is (and god do I know it's bad) but I am full on with Jean-Paul here. Cry, let it out, unpack the actual trauma later, for now, fight, and kick ass,

also, can Jubilee, Bobby, and Jean-Paul (hell Rictor too) be part of the same x-team? also... GOD I love when Jubilee let's loose.

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